Question:

I can’t help wondering if, deep down, you guys really enjoy a juicy argument and that, for you, life on this NG gets a little dull when all folk are permitted to do compare notes on what meds how many puffs

This is an unmoderated newsgroup, no one has to get permission to post a message, including you or me.

Response:

Have you considered seeing an Alergy Specialist? In the Fall some trees (especially Oaks)  have pollen which can trigger a coughing spell. Ask you family Doctor to prescribe an Mild Alergy medication to get you through the Fall. Sue P.S. Dump the Flovent!  

Response:

Have you considered seeing an Alergy Specialist? In the Fall some trees (especially Oaks)  have pollen which can trigger a coughing spell. Ask you family Doctor to prescribe an Mild Alergy medication to get you through the Fall. Sue P.S. Dump the Flovent!  

Why are you recommending that the Flovent be dropped and an antihistamine substituted instead?  An antihistamine only works against the early phase allergic response, while this response can trigger an asthma attack it requires that the lungs be ‘primed’ by the late phase response.  Current asthma treatment focuses on controlling the late phase allergic response as this is what will truly prevent asthma symptoms. "Being responsible sometimes means pissing people off."    General Colin Powell

Response:

He doesn’t care about winning the argument as long as he gets enough of his theory out to make newcomers curious to.

Very accurate statement. I read so much of it that I went to the address to check it out. I had read enough on the newsgroup to make me beware. I will not be returning.

Response:

You hit the nail right on the head Cloud9.  Although Colin and Eric are doing an excellent job of countering the bogus theories and sales pitches which circulate around this group, I am starting to wonder if the best policy might be to simply ignore the more objectional posters.  What I have noticed is that when Colin, Eric, Ellis, and others make a counterargument, the quacks rise to the bate and sometimes get downright nasty.

I am beginning to think that you guys are guilty of perpetuating these arguments. Looking at the postings recently, I’ve noticed that one Buteyko, or other alternative medicine subject, engenders rather an excess of couter- postings. Sometimes, these counter-postings are merely follow ups to existing counter-posts. I can’t help wondering if, deep down, you guys really enjoy a juicy argument and that, for you, life on this NG gets a little dull when all folk are permitted to do compare notes on what meds how many puffs they’re taking, etc. They seem to enjoy the verbal tug-of-war

Don’t you all? Perhaps I am naive but I think they might get borred and go away if we just quit paying attention to them.  

Then you’ll all get bored with nothing controvertial or sensational to argue about. Jo.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You hit the nail right on the head Cloud9.  Although Colin and Eric are doing an excellent job of countering the bogus theories and sales pitches which circulate around this group, I am starting to wonder if the best policy might be to simply ignore the more objectional posters.  What I have noticed is that when Colin, Eric, Ellis, and others make a counterargument, the quacks rise to the bate and sometimes get downright nasty.  They seem to enjoy the verbal tug-of-war just as much as promoting their foolishness in the first place.  Perhaps I am naive but I think they might get borred and go away if we just quit paying attention to them.   My concern is for the new members.  You notice that Peter always propositions the people who are new here because he knows that the more experienced people recognize him as a fraud. "Being responsible sometimes means pissing people off."   General Colin Powell

Good point, Colin.  To be honest, I had not noticed that Peter is targeting newcomers to the group but after you pointed this out, I went back and looked at some of the threads from newbies and indeed they tend to receive the bulk of the spam.  I have forgotten the URL for the ASSA FAQ so don’t know if this is already in there but it might be advisable to add a section on Buteyco and its promoters with a "buyer beware" tone.  If this kind of message is not appropriate for a general FAQ, then someone might want to compose such a message as an auto reply.  Then, whoever keeps this message can post or email it to anyone who posts for the first time.  Those who receive it would know who the quacks are and hopefully would choose not to respond to them. Any ideas?

Response:

To be honest, I had not noticed that Peter is targeting newcomers to the group but after you pointed this out, I went back and looked at some of the threads from newbies and indeed they tend to receive the bulk of the spam. … someone might want to compose such a message as an auto reply. Then, whoever keeps this message can post or email it to anyone who posts for the first time.  Those who receive it would know who the quacks are and hopefully would choose not to respond to them. Any ideas?

If I may suggest:

Question:

Has anyone else heard of or had the dry cough thing with pred?  I have one that I can’t get rid of  and can’t figure out why.  This might be the answer. Staci

Response:

Has anyone else heard of or had the dry cough thing with pred?  I have one that I can’t get rid of  and can’t figure out why.  This might be the answer. Staci

Dear Staci,   You could very well be right.  The docs may say no, but I have it and know of other people who have the same thing and are on Pred. That could be it.  I wouldn’t be surprised.  God knows it is chalk full of all kinds of side effects!  Maybe we place too much blame on Pred, but I doubt it!  LOL!! Love,   Margie CD Class of 67 UC Class of 96

Response:

Phil I believe I recall my doctor telling me that one of the possible side effects of prednisone is a ‘dry cough.’ I had a bit of a tickle, and a little dry cough when I was on prednisone, but not enough to be a problem. I was on 20 mg/day. Howard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all, Even though I have been on Prednislone before (as I have Crohns dieases) I think I might be having a allergic reaction to it. I’m on 5mg a day for a Rheumatoid arthritis problem in my hips. I was on 10 mg a day, but started getting hot flushes, so doctor thought best to reduce dose to 5 mg. What the problem is I am having what I guess would be described as coughing fits. Not a whole lot of mucus comes up, what does is clear, so no infection. but my sinus’s have gone even worse than usual. (I do have a stubborn staph infection in left sinus that even after two lots of surgery still will not clear) I know Prednislone is used for asthma treatment, but it seems as it is doing the opposite for me, well sort of. I am also on Slazaprine for some Arthritis problem. Could either of these drugs be causing the coughing, tickle in my chest? Doctor check chest, all sounded clear. E-mail replies please Thanks Phil

Response:

Hi all, Even though I have been on Prednislone before (as I have Crohns dieases) I think I might be having a allergic reaction to it. I’m on 5mg a day for a Rheumatoid arthritis problem in my hips. I was on 10 mg a day, but started getting hot flushes, so doctor thought best to reduce dose to 5 mg. What the problem is I am having what I guess would be described as coughing fits. Not a whole lot of mucus comes up, what does is clear, so no infection. but my sinus’s have gone even worse than usual. (I do have a stubborn staph infection in left sinus that even after two lots of surgery still will not clear) I know Prednislone is used for asthma treatment, but it seems as it is doing the opposite for me, well sort of. I am also on Slazaprine for some Arthritis problem. Could either of these drugs be causing the coughing, tickle in my chest? Doctor check chest, all sounded clear. E-mail replies please Thanks Phil

Response:

Question:

I don’t see anywhere a statement that he wants a cat.  His son wants to give him one.  Probably thinks it would be easy to care for, etc. The man might just as soon like a dog.  I KNOW they aren’t the same, believe me.  I wouldn’t want a dog, but I have 4 cats. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Also, I’ve heard one vet say that siammese and their relatives are extra allergenic. I just don’t understand getting a new cat if you know your father has allergies.  I found out I was allergic to them after getting 3, and it would have hurt me to part with them. He’d  probably have a better chance with dogs that are known to be less allergenic.  He’d have to strip his home of anything that would hold allergens too. Well, yes he’d have a better chance with dogs since he’s allergic to CATS, but he wants a cat!  They are not the same! The pads or the spray aren’t very good.  The best thing is to bathe the cat….every 2 weeks should be OK.   Be careful ONLY to use CAT shampoo, when shampoo is used at all.  Most of the time, just plain water is OK. A final rinse for the coat can be made from 1 part Downy fabric softener and 4 parts water (but you’ll probably do better with a fabric softener that has less of a scent as cats don’t generally care for some scents). I also add a little lemon juice.  This rinse was suggested by my veterinarian and it works well for me….and I have terrible allergies (cats, grass, dust, ragweed trees and molds).  Actually, if you look at the ingredients of a lot of the wipes and cat sprays for allergies you’ll see things like distilled water, emollients, citric acid and aloe among the ingredients.  Also, carpeting/rugs are not good for cat allergies as they become a reservoir of cat allergen.  Cat allergen is sticky (and airborne) which makes it accumulate in certain fabrics.  I think there is a spray to denature the allergen in carpets though (but I not sure since I have all hardwood floors….because of my allergies). As far as breeds go, I’m not sure if there is really an "hypoallergenic breed" despite the claims.  One thing I do know is that un-neutered males are significantly more allergenic then females, and neutered males are less allergenic. Good luck.  Hope things work out for your dad…..cats are great companions. Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work? Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob — Colette

– Colette

Response:

You’re right, it is nonsteroidal.  Still, I hear it’s pretty expensive.  Why introduce a cat into his father’s home if it will cause him new problems? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – : asthma treatment that is costly and hard on the body.  I know, because : I’ve weaned myself off ashma meds and just use the shots now.  It was Are you sure that that one is as harsh as the others? Seems to me they are talking about one of its benefits being it is not a steroid (and those are harsh, I know cause I take them) and might work just as well. So, it seems one of the things they are saying about this one is it is different tahn the major types of drugs being given for asthma therefore has the chance of being less harsh, while potentially working just as well. If this is actually true, I would be ecstatic. I agree with you that steroids are harsh on the body. Of course, any doctor will tell you for allergies it’s best not to expose yourself to the allergen, so if he doesn’t really care for cats, why force the issue on him? But if he wants a cat and is allergic, then maybe he’ll find the risk acceptable (I’ve read that even allergies can develop into asthma if provoked enough, and let me tell you, asthma is something one should avoid like the plague). Tigress — The root cause of problems is simple overpopulation.  People just aren’t worth very much any more, and they know it.  Makes ‘em testy. …Bev    |    _,,,—,,_          Tigress   /,`.-’`’    -.  ;-;;,_     http://havoc.gtf.gatech.edu/tigress ‘—”(_/–’  `-’_)         Cat by Felix Lee.

– Colette

Response:

Also, I’ve heard one vet say that siammese and their relatives are extra allergenic. I just don’t understand getting a new cat if you know your father has allergies.  I found out I was allergic to them after getting 3, and it would have hurt me to part with them. He’d  probably have a better chance with dogs that are known to be less allergenic.  He’d have to strip his home of anything that would hold allergens too.

Well, yes he’d have a better chance with dogs since he’s allergic to CATS, but he wants a cat!  They are not the same! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The pads or the spray aren’t very good.  The best thing is to bathe the cat….every 2 weeks should be OK.   Be careful ONLY to use CAT shampoo, when shampoo is used at all.  Most of the time, just plain water is OK. A final rinse for the coat can be made from 1 part Downy fabric softener and 4 parts water (but you’ll probably do better with a fabric softener that has less of a scent as cats don’t generally care for some scents). I also add a little lemon juice.  This rinse was suggested by my veterinarian and it works well for me….and I have terrible allergies (cats, grass, dust, ragweed trees and molds).  Actually, if you look at the ingredients of a lot of the wipes and cat sprays for allergies you’ll see things like distilled water, emollients, citric acid and aloe among the ingredients.  Also, carpeting/rugs are not good for cat allergies as they become a reservoir of cat allergen.  Cat allergen is sticky (and airborne) which makes it accumulate in certain fabrics.  I think there is a spray to denature the allergen in carpets though (but I not sure since I have all hardwood floors….because of my allergies). As far as breeds go, I’m not sure if there is really an "hypoallergenic breed" despite the claims.  One thing I do know is that un-neutered males are significantly more allergenic then females, and neutered males are less allergenic. Good luck.  Hope things work out for your dad…..cats are great companions. Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work? Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob — Colette

Response:

I have asthma and 6 permanent indoor cats, and I’m fine with just Accolate – it doesn’t have any side effects that I can tell, at all, although it is a bit pricey, yes. My asthma guy has never suggested shots – is that the same as the de-sensitivization process?

Response:

Accolate is not hard on the body.  Where did you get that information?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Accolate.  It is pretty strong medicine to take, and I wouldn’t reco getting a new cat and then having to turn to that medicine.  It’s an asthma treatment that is costly and hard on the body.  I know, because I’ve weaned myself off ashma meds and just use the shots now.  It was a long process. Just recently a new medicine came out that is supposed to help sufferers of cat allergies.  Unfortunatley, I do not remember the name of it, but hopefully someone else will see your post and mention it. I would ask an allergist about it.  I would think they would be up on the latest in their field.  If not, I know there was an article on it in Reuters Medical website.  You can do a search there and pull up the article.  It wasn’t that long ago – this past spring. Good luck. Tracy Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work? Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob — Colette

Response:

: asthma treatment that is costly and hard on the body.  I know, because : I’ve weaned myself off ashma meds and just use the shots now.  It was Are you sure that that one is as harsh as the others? Seems to me they are talking about one of its benefits being it is not a steroid (and those are harsh, I know cause I take them) and might work just as well. So, it seems one of the things they are saying about this one is it is different tahn the major types of drugs being given for asthma therefore has the chance of being less harsh, while potentially working just as well. If this is actually true, I would be ecstatic. I agree with you that steroids are harsh on the body. Of course, any doctor will tell you for allergies it’s best not to expose yourself to the allergen, so if he doesn’t really care for cats, why force the issue on him? But if he wants a cat and is allergic, then maybe he’ll find the risk acceptable (I’ve read that even allergies can develop into asthma if provoked enough, and let me tell you, asthma is something one should avoid like the plague). Tigress — The root cause of problems is simple overpopulation.  People just aren’t worth very much any more, and they know it.  Makes ‘em testy. …Bev     |    _,,,—,,_          Tigress    /,`.-’`’    -.  ;-;;,_     http://havoc.gtf.gatech.edu/tigress  ’—”(_/–’  `-’_)         Cat by Felix Lee.

Response:

Also, I’ve heard one vet say that siammese and their relatives are extra allergenic.   I just don’t understand getting a new cat if you know your father has allergies.  I found out I was allergic to them after getting 3, and it would have hurt me to part with them. He’d  probably have a better chance with dogs that are known to be less allergenic.  He’d have to strip his home of anything that would hold allergens too. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The pads or the spray aren’t very good.  The best thing is to bathe the cat….every 2 weeks should be OK.   Be careful ONLY to use CAT shampoo, when shampoo is used at all.  Most of the time, just plain water is OK.  A final rinse for the coat can be made from 1 part Downy fabric softener and 4 parts water (but you’ll probably do better with a fabric softener that has less of a scent as cats don’t generally care for some scents). I also add a little lemon juice.  This rinse was suggested by my veterinarian and it works well for me….and I have terrible allergies (cats, grass, dust, ragweed trees and molds).  Actually, if you look at the ingredients of a lot of the wipes and cat sprays for allergies you’ll see things like distilled water, emollients, citric acid and aloe among the ingredients.  Also, carpeting/rugs are not good for cat allergies as they become a reservoir of cat allergen.  Cat allergen is sticky (and airborne) which makes it accumulate in certain fabrics.  I think there is a spray to denature the allergen in carpets though (but I not sure since I have all hardwood floors….because of my allergies). As far as breeds go, I’m not sure if there is really an "hypoallergenic breed" despite the claims.  One thing I do know is that un-neutered males are significantly more allergenic then females, and neutered males are less allergenic. Good luck.  Hope things work out for your dad…..cats are great companions. Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work?  Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob

– Colette

Response:

I am allergic to cats, and I’ve had to take allergy shots and take medicine.  It’s not easily overcome.  Why not get him a dog like a Bijon Freise or a poodle, which don’t seem to cause as much allergic problems as some other breeds? Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work?  Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob

– Colette

Response:

Accolate.  It is pretty strong medicine to take, and I wouldn’t reco getting a new cat and then having to turn to that medicine.  It’s an asthma treatment that is costly and hard on the body.  I know, because I’ve weaned myself off ashma meds and just use the shots now.  It was a long process. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Just recently a new medicine came out that is supposed to help sufferers of cat allergies.  Unfortunatley, I do not remember the name of it, but hopefully someone else will see your post and mention it.   I would ask an allergist about it.  I would think they would be up on the latest in their field.  If not, I know there was an article on it in Reuters Medical website.  You can do a search there and pull up the article.  It wasn’t that long ago – this past spring.   Good luck. Tracy Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work?  Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob

– Colette

Response:

Actually, that was the article behind the link I posted. Sorry it didn’t work, glad that MacCandace posted the article for you. Thank you and thumbs up, Mac! Juergen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – That’s it!  Thanks, Candace. Tracy [article clipped] Candace (take the litter out before replying by e-mail)

Response:

The pads or the spray aren’t very good.  The best thing is to bathe the cat….every 2 weeks should be OK.   Be careful ONLY to use CAT shampoo, when shampoo is used at all.  Most of the time, just plain water is OK.  A final rinse for the coat can be made from 1 part Downy fabric softener and 4 parts water (but you’ll probably do better with a fabric softener that has less of a scent as cats don’t generally care for some scents). I also add a little lemon juice.  This rinse was suggested by my veterinarian and it works well for me….and I have terrible allergies (cats, grass, dust, ragweed trees and molds).  Actually, if you look at the ingredients of a lot of the wipes and cat sprays for allergies you’ll see things like distilled water, emollients, citric acid and aloe among the ingredients.  Also, carpeting/rugs are not good for cat allergies as they become a reservoir of cat allergen.  Cat allergen is sticky (and airborne) which makes it accumulate in certain fabrics.  I think there is a spray to denature the allergen in carpets though (but I not sure since I have all hardwood floors….because of my allergies). As far as breeds go, I’m not sure if there is really an "hypoallergenic breed" despite the claims.  One thing I do know is that un-neutered males are significantly more allergenic then females, and neutered males are less allergenic. Good luck.  Hope things work out for your dad…..cats are great companions.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work?  Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob

Response:

Just recently a new medicine came out that is supposed to help sufferers of cat allergies.  Unfortunatley, I do not remember the name of it, but hopefully someone else will see your post and mention it.

Just one or two weeks ago somebody posted this URL: Is that what you were looking for? Juergen – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would ask an allergist about it.  I would think they would be up on the latest in their field.  If not, I know there was an article on it in Reuters Medical website.  You can do a search there and pull up the article.  It wasn’t that long ago – this past spring. Good luck. Tracy Hi, I would like to get a cat for my father, but he suffers from mild allergies.  How can I address this?  I know that there are certain breeds that are better for allergy sufferers, but they are so ugly (Devon Rex).  I have also heard of special pads that can be used to wipe down the cat twice a day to help reduce allergies.  Do these work?  Will an air filter and good vacuum help?  I would love to hear from anyone who has solved this problem – or failed to – any how.  Any info would be great. Thanks so much, Rob

Response:

That’s it!  Thanks, Candace. Tracy – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <<Just recently a new medicine came out that is supposed to help sufferers of cat allergies.  Unfortunatley, I do not remember the name of it, but hopefully someone else will see your post and mention it. I would ask an allergist about it.  I would think they would be up on the latest in their field.  If not, I know there was an article on it in Reuters Medical website.  You can do a search there and pull up the article.  It wasn’t that long ago – this past spring. Asthma Drug Offers Allergy Relief New medication prevents cat dander reactions By Nancy A. Melville HealthSCOUT Reporter SATURDAY, May 27 (HealthSCOUT) — A new drug to treat asthma also seems to be the cat’s meow for symptoms of feline allergies. While successfully treating asthma in adults and children, zafirlukast, known by the brand name Accolate, also prevents the wheezing, shortness of breath and itchy, runny noses triggered by allergens in cat dander, say researchers at Johns Hopkins Medical Center in Baltimore. The researchers tested 18 people with cat allergies, randomly giving them either the drug or a placebo for a week. The volunteers agreed to spend an hour in what was dubbed the "cat challenge room" — a carpeted room that was home to a couple of house cats and which contained bedding that was shaken just before a subject entered. The room provided "an extremely intense cat exposure, 10 to 100 times the level of allergens you would find in the home," say the researchers. The study found the number of allergic symptoms were significantly reduced by those taking zafirlukast. The findings were reported in last month’s Journal of Allergy and Clinical Immunology. Zafirlukast is one of a relatively new class of asthma medicines known as leukotriene antagonists, which block chemicals released by lung cells that cause allergic symptoms. "We tested cat allergies because that’s what we’re set up for, but that’s really a good model for any kind of allergic asthma. You would expect that if a drug works for one allergic trigger, it could work for others as well," says lead researcher Dr. Robert Wood, an associate professor of pediatrics. The only other drug in the class of leukotriene antagonists, would probably offer similar benefits, says Wood. "There’s just one other drug in that class now and we’re doing a very similar study with that that we’re just finishing up." Wood says zafirlukast, given in pill form, is preferable to steroids to treat asthma medications. "Steroid drugs are very effective for asthma, but we would prefer to use other alternatives, as long as they’re safe. That goes especially for children because there is some concern about possible side effects steroids could have," Wood says. "If you had a non-steroid drug that worked as well as a steroid, we would always prescribe the non-steroid drug," he says. Wood says he found no significant side effects from zafirlukast, with just a few reports of mild headaches and one person reporting diarrhea. Dr. Sheldon Spector, a clinical professor of medicine at the University of California at Los Angeles, reports a similar study with zafirlukast with similar results. "We also had a cat room and found that people on zafirlukast really felt better and had significant improvements in their allergies," he says. What To Do Visit the American Academy of Allergy, Asthma and Immunology for more information on research into allergies and asthma. Copyright

Question:

My daughter(age16) is steroid dependent and her asthma has been proving to be quite stubborn. I have posted ? here before and everyone is very helpful. She is currently taking 40 mg of medrol a day and has for some time. We are unable to get her dose down without serious flareups, but it seems that she isn’t getting well at this dose either. She is in a slump. She has allergies as well as reflux, and takes several meds( seems to stay on antibiotic as well). Her asthma Dr. really wants to get her off the medrol, but she just went in and her spirometry showed moderate obstruction, and did not change after a treatment-it had only been 2 hrs since her previous treatment..  It usually goes up afterwards. He said some values were lower, but probably because she was able to blow more air. He gave her a shot of depo-medrol to see if that helped, and the next day she felt better. Is the depomedrol a longer acting medrol??  She was also having a rash on her face which he seemed to think was an allergic reaction to something. Has anyone else had this experience with steroids. It is as though her body develops a tolerance and requires increasing doses. She hasn’t had any obvious side effects yet except that he thinks it may be contributing to her having a couple of bones break close together. We are going to talk to her primary about this. It is very frustrating and she is tired of being sick.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My daughter(age16) is steroid dependent and her asthma has been proving to be quite stubborn. I have posted ? here before and everyone is very helpful. She is currently taking 40 mg of medrol a day and has for some time. We are unable to get her dose down without serious flareups, but it seems that she isn’t getting well at this dose either. She is in a slump. She has allergies as well as reflux, and takes several meds( seems to stay on antibiotic as well). Her asthma Dr. really wants to get her off the medrol, but she just went in and her spirometry showed moderate obstruction, and did not change after a treatment-it had only been 2 hrs since her previous treatment..  It usually goes up afterwards. He said some values were lower, but probably because she was able to blow more air. He gave her a shot of depo-medrol to see if that helped, and the next day she felt better. Is the depomedrol a longer acting medrol??  She was also having a rash on her face which he seemed to think was an allergic reaction to something. Has anyone else had this experience with steroids. It is as though her body develops a tolerance and requires increasing doses. She hasn’t had any obvious side effects yet except that he thinks it may be contributing to her having a couple of bones break close together. We are going to talk to her primary about this. It is very frustrating and she is tired of being sick.

Regarding the broken bones, a bone densitometer test is recommended for anyone on oral steroids for over 2 months. See: http://odp.od.nih.gov/consensus/cons/111/111_intro.htm Osteoporosis Prevention, Diagnosis, and Therapy March 27-29, 2000 NIH Draft Consensus Statement Regarding the steroid-dependent asthma, perhaps she is steroid-resistant. See: http://www.ama-assn.org/special/asthma/library/scan/archive/resist.htm * Steroid-Resistant Asthma: Evaluation and Management Abstract Nov 96 http://www.NationalJewish.org/corticosteroids.html Corticosteroids Excerpt: "Osteoporosis Long-term oral corticosteroid use depletes the bones of calcium which can lead to osteoporosis. Osteoporosis, or brittle bones, places you at greater risk of fractures. Even low-dose corticosteroid therapy can cause this calcium loss;" Difficult steroid dependent cases of asthma are best diagnosed at a major asthma center; National Jewish Center is rated #1 in the US; www.njc.org 1-800-222-LUNG Depo-Medrol and Medrol are just trade names for methylprednisolone. Ellis

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Have you considered a second opinion?  My first asthma doctor (and I really liked him) didn’t do me much good – - he was content to let me be sick and living a half life.  The second had many ideas and in short order had me functioning better than I had in three years with the other fellow.  The new dr.  is so abrupt and abrasive it has taken me a long time to feel comfortable with him, but I tolerate that because he seems to know what will work for me. If you can find a quote about a carnation, you will be a sensation!

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I believe the longer I am on steroids the harder it is for me to get better.  The initial burst will help, but prolonged use just kills me. Weaning off is virtually impossible.  The attacks get more frequent and severe. My doctor has tried medical alternative treatments such as cyclosporine, mega doses of Biaxin and IVIG.  I also spent two weeks at National Jewish in Denver. National Jewish covered all the basis, including bone density testing, allergy testing, pH probe (for reflux) and everything else for my asthma. Maybe it’s time to explore other options for your daughter.  As my teenagers say "Prednisone is evil."   I hope she starts doing better.  Good Luck.  Lisa – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My daughter(age16) is steroid dependent and her asthma has been proving to be quite stubborn. I have posted ? here before and everyone is very helpful. She is currently taking 40 mg of medrol a day and has for some time. We are unable to get her dose down without serious flareups, but it seems that she isn’t getting well at this dose either. She is in a slump. She has allergies as well as reflux, and takes several meds( seems to stay on antibiotic as well). Her asthma Dr. really wants to get her off the medrol, but she just went in and her spirometry showed moderate obstruction, and did not change after a treatment-it had only been 2 hrs since her previous treatment..  It usually goes up afterwards. He said some values were lower, but probably because she was able to blow more air. He gave her a shot of depo-medrol to see if that helped, and the next day she felt better. Is the depomedrol a longer acting medrol??  She was also having a rash on her face which he seemed to think was an allergic reaction to something. Has anyone else had this experience with steroids. It is as though her body develops a tolerance and requires increasing doses. She hasn’t had any obvious side effects yet except that he thinks it may be contributing to her having a couple of bones break close together. We are going to talk to her primary about this. It is very frustrating and she is tired of being sick.

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Has anyone else had this experience with steroids. It is as though her body develops a tolerance and requires increasing doses.

Hiya – I have been steroid dependent for the last three years.  My doctor is awesome, she does a lot of research, always looking for new ways to try and wean me off the steroids.   I will tell you that I was in a study group for a new mometasone steroid inhaler that had me down to 2 mg of prednisone a day, from my normal 20 or 30. I was very sorry when the study ended and I had to stop the medicine, and right away went back to 30mg a day. My question for you – what else is she taking besides the medrol??  I am on Proventil (inhaler, neb when needed), Serevent, Flovent, Claritin and the prednisone.  Is she on the long acting inhalers? Maybe she can either try them, or if she is already taking them increase the dosage of those?? Increasing the dosages of Serevent and Flovent got me from 40mg to 20mg – sometimes 30mg. Talk to your doctor about it, it might help. Good luck to both of you!! Life is uncertain – eat dessert first. Nancy 8=: )

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -My daughter(age16) is steroid dependent and her asthma has been proving to be quite stubborn. I have posted ? here before and everyone is very helpful. She is currently taking 40 mg of medrol a day and has for some time. We are unable to get her dose down without serious flareups, but it seems that she isn’t getting well at this dose either. She is in a slump. She has allergies as well as reflux, and takes several meds( seems to stay on antibiotic as well). Her asthma Dr. really wants to get her off the medrol, but she just went in and her spirometry showed moderate obstruction, and did not change after a treatment-it had only been 2 hrs since her previous treatment..  It usually goes up afterwards. He said some values were lower, but probably because she was able to blow more air. He gave her a shot of depo-medrol to see if that helped, and the next day she felt better. Is the depomedrol a longer acting medrol??  She was also having a rash on her face which he seemed to think was an allergic reaction to something. Has anyone else had this experience with steroids. It is as though her body develops a tolerance and requires increasing doses. She hasn’t had any obvious side effects yet except that he thinks it may be contributing to her having a couple of bones break close together. We are going to talk to her primary about this. It is very frustrating and she is tired of being sick.

Have you asked for a referral to a regional asthma center?  Or even to someplace such as John Hopkins, or National Jewish medical centers? (These facilities are tied for the title of ‘Best asthma treatment center in the world.’) "Keep looking below surface appearances. Don’t shrink from doing so (just) because you might not like what you find."    General Colin Powell

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Have you asked for a referral to a regional asthma center?  Or even to someplace such as John Hopkins, or National Jewish medical centers? (These facilities are tied for the title of ‘Best asthma treatment center in the world.’)

I haven’t asked, but her Dr. has mentioned it.    We keep thinking things will get better and she is just having a rough spot..but maybe not.  Being a teenager, she sees going somewhere else a disruption and probably thinks she has been this way for so long that it won’t change anyway.  However, maybe she will start to see things differently.

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Have you asked for a referral to a regional asthma center? I haven’t asked, but her Dr. has mentioned it.

Sounds like it might be time. There are a lot of things that can be tried including better management of the allergic and reflux components as well as other methods of treatment such as lidocaine, methotrexate, cyclosporin, and high doses of inhaled steroids. The bone issue could be cleared up with a dexa scan. She should be taking calcium supplements and a multiviatmin. She should also see an opthomologist for screening of ocular side effects such as cataracts and glaucoma. — CBI, M.D. Please note: It is impossible to accurately diagnose medical problems without seeing the patient and reviewing the entire history. These posts are intended to be helpful and informative. Always check with your doctor before following any advice given.

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I lost the post and the name of the author, but someone asked me what other meds she was on.  She takes prevacid 60mg in a.m., 30mg in p.m.,  propulsid 10mg 4x daily,  singulair 1 daily,  pulmicort 3puffs 2x daily,  serevent 2x daily,  Nasarel 2x daily, actenol 1 daily, maxair as needed, Xopenex in neb 3x day-or more if needed,(adding atrovent at times). She is currently on cleocin(antibiotic) and sometimes adds in Volmax at M.D.’s instruction.  Her medrol is 16 in a.m., and 24 in p.m. Even on this regimen she wheezes daily.   She will see her primary next week and I plan to ask about the bone density test.

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There are a lot of things that can be tried including better management of the allergic and reflux components as well as other methods of treatment such as lidocaine, methotrexate, cyclosporin, and high doses of inhaled steroids.

Her gastro Dr. feels that other than surgery she is on the meds that work best for her….it is better than before and we have tried many meds.  As for the inhaled steroids she has been on high doses(she was taking 3 puffs of flovent in addition to the pulmicort) but her dr felt if she had to be on the oral we had to reduce the inhaled. He has expressed to me many times that he feels what we are doing with the steroids is dangerous…….but she needs them to breathe.  By lidocaine, do you mean in the neb??  We have actually tried that for the bad coughing, but she has gotten to where she doesn’t have the coughing episodes much…just closes up.   Thanks for the advice, I will take up these issues with her asthma Dr. and pulmo. He is always open to any suggestions that we feel may help, since it is her body and she knows how she feels .    We haven’t tried allergy shots in a couple of years because she reacts to even a minute amount even when on an antihistimine and hasn’t been stable enough.      Perhaps the time is near to get a fresh look at things. Thanks so much

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She should be taking calcium supplements and a multiviatmin.

She is on calcium supplements due to milk and dairy allergy

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: Have you considered a second opinion?  My first asthma doctor (and I : really liked him) didn’t do me much good – - he was content to let me be : sick and living a half life.  The second had many ideas and in short : order had me functioning better than I had in three years with the other : fellow.  The new dr.  is so abrupt and abrasive it has taken me a long : time to feel comfortable with him, but I tolerate that because he seems : to know what will work for me. One of the best doctors I know is very hard to get along with and I have known him all my life. He is the best diogonstition I have ever met. He has a ego to go with it. One thing about growing up in a small town you had to learn to get along with everybody or have everybody discussing your problems:) — Gordon    W5RED www.couger.com/gcouger "You miss 100 percent of the shots you never take."   – Wayne Gretzky

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It may be worth the surgery. Some gastro’s recommend the surgery to all young people with reflux even of they are controlled on meds (I wouldn’t go quite this far). Yes, I meant lidocaine in the neb. If it worked for the coughing you may want to reconsider it for the wheezing. — CBI, M.D. Please note: It is impossible to accurately diagnose medical problems without seeing the patient and reviewing the entire history. These posts are intended to be helpful and informative. Always check with your doctor before following any advice given.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There are a lot of things that can be tried including better management of the allergic and reflux components as well as other methods of treatment such as lidocaine, methotrexate, cyclosporin, and high doses of inhaled steroids. Her gastro Dr. feels that other than surgery she is on the meds that work best for her….it is better than before and we have tried many meds.  As for the inhaled steroids she has been on high doses(she was taking 3 puffs of flovent in addition to the pulmicort) but her dr felt if she had to be on the oral we had to reduce the inhaled. He has expressed to me many times that he feels what we are doing with the steroids is dangerous…….but she needs them to breathe.  By lidocaine, do you mean in the neb??  We have actually tried that for the bad coughing, but she has gotten to where she doesn’t have the coughing episodes much…just closes up.   Thanks for the advice, I will take up these issues with her asthma Dr. and pulmo. He is always open to any suggestions that we feel may help, since it is her body and she knows how she feels .    We haven’t tried allergy shots in a couple of years because she reacts to even a minute amount even when on an antihistimine and hasn’t been stable enough.      Perhaps the time is near to get a fresh look at things. Thanks so much

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There was a recent study that showed that bone density in young women can be increased by supplementing about the current recommendations. I believe they took on the order of 1500 mg above the diet. The bad news is they lost the ground if they stopped so she would need to make a life long commitment (at least until we have better). — CBI, M.D. Please note: It is impossible to accurately diagnose medical problems without seeing the patient and reviewing the entire history. These posts are intended to be helpful and informative. Always check with your doctor before following any advice given.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – She should be taking calcium supplements and a multiviatmin. She is on calcium supplements due to milk and dairy allergy

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There was a recent study that showed that bone density in young women can be increased by supplementing about the current recommendations. I believe they took on the order of 1500 mg above the diet.

2 years ago, an endocrinologist suggested she take 1200mg, but that was before we had her completely off dairy. She agreed at the time, that lack of estrogen played a part as well. She has grown a lot since then, however she still has very little body fat, which seems to be a factor in delayed onset of periods. She will be 17 in 1 month, so I will discuss with her primary care(pediatrician…but treats many adolescents as well). I will ask her about the increase of Calcium as well.    Are yopu familiar with the new med-Actonel-suppost to help with bone density loss due to steroid use, osteoporisis, etc. Her asthma Dr. gave her some samples to try. He says he hasn’t tried it on anyone yet.    As for the lidocain..it wasn’t a great help, and we had to go to the hosp.pharmacy to get it.   Thanks for all the help and suggestions. I think the allergis factor is a big hinderance, since she is always breaking out -reacting to something, and has all her life.

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I was steroid dependent for 10 years, tho not as bad as your daughter’s case. My daily dose was 10Mg and rising.Finding the right doc meant finding the answer. It was: Reduce 1mg pred/day every 2 weeks til off. 1 puff Serevent diskus am and pm 4 puffs 220 Flovent am and pm. I am now asthma clear and have been for 4 months. Good luck.   Jay

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I was steroid dependent for 10 years, tho not as bad as your daughter’s case. My daily dose was 10Mg and rising.Finding the right doc meant finding the answer. It was: Reduce 1mg pred/day every 2 weeks til off. 1 puff Serevent diskus am and pm 4 puffs 220 Flovent am and pm. I am now asthma clear and have been for 4 months. Good luck.   Jay

We didn’t try reducing in 1mg increments, but have tried 2mg’s but she reaches a point and has a major flair. She went in today, and her Dr. was discouraged because we weren’t getting anywhere, He decided to try her on deltasone, thinking possibly it will work better…that maybe her body just wasn’t recognizing something in the medrol(He originally said he preferred the medrol because he felt it had fewer side effects)  She is on 60 for 5 days and we will take her down to 40 from thatfor at least 10 days. I am glad you are much better and off the steroids, but it all sounds too simple to me.She is using a lot of other meds as well.  Thanks for the advice

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: We didn’t try reducing in 1mg increments, but have tried 2mg’s but she reaches : a point and has a major flair. She went in today, and her Dr. was discouraged : because we weren’t getting anywhere, He decided to try her on deltasone, : thinking possibly it will work better…that maybe her body just wasn’t : recognizing something in the medrol(He originally said he preferred the medrol : because he felt it had fewer side effects)  She is on 60 for 5 days and we will : take her down to 40 from thatfor at least 10 days. : : I am glad you are much better and off the steroids, but it all sounds too : simple to me.She is using a lot of other meds as well.  Thanks for the advice The way I got off was when I got down to 5 mg I started taking it every other day. But my asthma was almost resolved. You might talk to your doctor about taking the steriods every other day. This is supposed to reduce the side effects a good deal. The thing that helped my astham the most was cleaning the air conditioning ducts, putting electorstatic filters in the return and sealing the intake system from the filters to the furnace/AC as good as I could with duct tape. My next step will be to install a heat exchanger that brings in 15% outside air when the pollen and molds are not too high. good luck — Gordon    W5RED www.couger.com/gcouger "You miss 100 percent of the shots you never take."   – Wayne Gretzky

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You might talk to your doctor about taking the steriods every other day. This is supposed to reduce the side effects a good deal.

Actually that is the ultimate plan. Thanks

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Question:

My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it.

Are you actually allergic to cats or is this the standard ‘ get rid of the cats’ line? — "We are fighting today for security, for progress, and for peace, not only for ourselves but for all men, not only for one generation but for all generations. We are fighting to cleanse the world of ancient evils, ancient ills." Franklin Delano Rosevelt State of the Union Address – 1942

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My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it. Are you actually allergic to cats or is this the standard ‘ get rid of the cats’ line?

Unfortunately, most allergists were or are allergic themselves; that’s how they became interested in the field. As so many of them were not allowed pets when they were children, they are not aware of the nature of the relationship we have with pets, and are capable of broadcasting such advice without regard to a particular patient’s specific allergies. When you are selecting a new allergist, call the office and ask the clerk if her doctor owns a pet. Go to one who does.          Larry

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The bottom line is if you are allergic to an animal you shouldn’t have it in your home. No matter how attached, why would you fill yourself with drugs to keep a pet? If you are not allergic fine but to keep it and make yourself or your family ill is just plain insanity. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it. Are you actually allergic to cats or is this the standard ‘ get rid of the cats’ line? Unfortunately, most allergists were or are allergic themselves; that’s how they became interested in the field. As so many of them were not allowed pets when they were children, they are not aware of the nature of the relationship we have with pets, and are capable of broadcasting such advice without regard to a particular patient’s specific allergies. When you are selecting a new allergist, call the office and ask the clerk if her doctor owns a pet. Go to one who does.      Larry

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The point I had hoped to make is that a doctor should not just casually tell a patient to get rid of a pet unless he has evidence that the pet is causing illness. I don’t think you often need to remind allergists of this if they themselves have pets. Otherwise, Tea Monkey, you are absolutely right.      Larry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The bottom line is if you are allergic to an animal you shouldn’t have it in your home. No matter how attached, why would you fill yourself with drugs to keep a pet? If you are not allergic fine but to keep it and make yourself or your family ill is just plain insanity. My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it. Are you actually allergic to cats or is this the standard ‘ get rid of the cats’ line? Unfortunately, most allergists were or are allergic themselves; that’s how they became interested in the field. As so many of them were not allowed pets when they were children, they are not aware of the nature of the relationship we have with pets, and are capable of broadcasting such advice without regard to a particular patient’s specific allergies. When you are selecting a new allergist, call the office and ask the clerk if her doctor owns a pet. Go to one who does.      Larry

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What a crock… you must own a cattle ranch, ’cause yer so fulla bullshit you wake up with brown stains on your pillow from it pouring out your ears. Sheldon

Sheldon, I can only imagine how terribly frustrating it must be when you to wish to express yourself, yet find that your only tools are a dozen-and-a-half random obscenities that you feel compelled to shuffle and reshuffle month after month after month. I am sure it would help you to communicate much more effectively if you were to read a book. You could select the first one blindfolded, as everything (and everyone) I have ever known between covers is more articulate than you. I would suggest that a good, easy book with which to start would be one of the classic works of Franklin W. Dixon. When you feel you have mastered the vocabulary, grammar and literary conventions and devices of this author, I would then suggest Anna Sewell’s best known study of personal relationships and motivations. From there you might test your comprehension by investigating the more difficult literary oeuvre of Eric Mowbry Knight. Finally, you should master the style of expression and more complex philosophies of Hugh Lofting. I really think you should not extend yourself into the involved and multilayered and more subtle Weltanschauung of L. Frank Baum until you have allowed yourself several months of intense concentration on the earlier volumes I have suggested. If you have gotten that far without being discouraged and again inextricably mired in your swamp of confusion, I am sure any one of us here would be able to help you prepare a further reading list. Continued study should make it possible for you eventually to carry on meaningful conversation in this newsgroup, and I am sure would help you in rec.food.cooking as well. I hope to hear from you again, possibly in eighteen months or so. Good reading, Sheldon. Thanks are not necessary,      Larry

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The bottom line is if you are allergic to an animal you shouldn’t have it in your home. No matter how attached, why would you fill yourself with drugs to keep a pet? If you are not allergic fine but to keep it and make yourself or your family ill is just plain insanity.

I’d say that this is a decision that each person has to make on their own. I went through years of allergy shots so that I could once again own cats.  And owning cats means that I have to be more careful managing my total allergen load – but my focus is on my total ‘quality of life’ which my asthma is only another input. Remember that the goal of an asthma treatment program is to allow the patient to live his or her life completely and fully.  Too many doctors seem to forget this as they are only looking at the asthma. — "We are fighting today for security, for progress, and for peace, not only for ourselves but for all men, not only for one generation but for all generations. We are fighting to cleanse the world of ancient evils, ancient ills." Franklin Delano Rosevelt State of the Union Address – 1942

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The bottom line is if you are allergic to an animal you shouldn’t have it in your home. No matter how attached, why would you fill yourself with drugs to keep a pet? If you are not allergic fine but to keep it and make yourself or your family ill is just plain insanity.

Fortunately the real world is not so black and white.  The allergic response illicited by a pet can vary.  Perhaps a cat only becomes bothersome if it sits next to your head, perhaps a dog only bother you if you handle it frequently and don’t wash your hands afterwards.  Or, like myself, you test positively for a skin prick test but the real things don’t seem to have any effect.  Or, as jr, wrote

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – if you have been tested find out which serum was used! not all cats have all chemicals that cause allergies.  my cats don’t bother me, but if tested with PHD (pelt, hair, dander) serum it is my worst reaction.  if tested with serum from other company, which is only saliva i don’t react.  all cats have chemical in their saliva.  not all cats have all the other chemicals. also, there are treatments to reduce allergens on cat and on furniture. try dr foster catalog or web site. sorry don’t remember url.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Larry Preuss writes: What a crock… you must own a cattle ranch, ’cause yer so fulla bullshit you wake up with brown stains on your pillow from it pouring out your ears. Sheldon, I can only imagine how terribly frustrating it must be when you to wish to express yourself, yet find that your only tools are a dozen-and-a-half random obscenities What is it about "Fuck You, Larry", "Larry’s Momma is a Ho" and "Larry is a Shit For Brains" that you don’t understand. Sheldon "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

Got that high-colonic set on ‘puree’ again?

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Sheldon crawl back under that rock you own.  You vocabulary show your intellegence and so far you are a zero!  UM MOM Susan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Larry Preuss writes: What a crock… you must own a cattle ranch, ’cause yer so fulla bullshit you wake up with brown stains on your pillow from it pouring out your ears. Sheldon, I can only imagine how terribly frustrating it must be when you to wish to express yourself, yet find that your only tools are a dozen-and-a-half random obscenities What is it about "Fuck You, Larry", "Larry’s Momma is a Ho" and "Larry is a Shit For Brains" that you don’t understand. Sheldon "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

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"sdores" Dumb Twat writes: Sheldon crawl back under that rock you own.  You vocabulary show your intellegence and so far you are a zero! Thought you were going to ignore me, you spineless dumb twat who can’t spell *intelligence* because you have none… and how many more times will you threaten to leave, loser! Sheldon

Sheldon, one of my all-time favorite examples of your spelling is this exchange, in which you misspelled two words while attacking a woman who had misspelled none. I could cite more, but this is so uproariously funny, and typical of you, that I don’t think it necessary.      Larry – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ….I don’t get sedatives. Sure, wrote "seditives"… didn’t know how to spell "tranquilizer". Sheldon

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Unfortunately, most allergists were or are allergic themselves; that’s how they became interested in the field. As so many of them were not allowed pets when they were children, they are not aware of the nature of the relationship we have with pets, and are capable of broadcasting such advice without regard to a particular patient’s specific allergies. When you are selecting a new allergist, call the office and ask the clerk if her doctor owns a pet. Go to one who does.

I think we go about this the wrong way. Lots of folks want to have pet animals. The issue should be which species are least likely to cause allergic reactions in most people. I guess that any animal with dander (which means furry mammals) can cause allergic reactions in some people. But I’ll bet these are probably safe for most people: – Turtles – Reptiles – Tropical Fish – Ants (many children love to watch ant farms) Do many asthmatics have problems with birds (parakeets, parrots, etc.)?? — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  

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I went through years of allergy shots so that I could once again own cats.  

Colin, this is one of the very few times that I think you have plunged into the same non-rationality that typifies so many of the quacks you denounce so often. Cats aren’t worth risking your health. Cats aren’t worth anything. I’m sure you could have found some other species of animal that you weren’t allergic to, to keep as a pet. Remember that the goal of an asthma treatment program is to allow the patient to live his or her life completely and fully.

If you think that "living a full life" depends on having CATS in your house, then you have really gone beyond the bend. — Steven D. Litvintchouk                  

Response:

My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it.

Have you been tested for being allergic to cats?  If not get tested.  If you are not allergic to them there is no point in rehoming them.  If you are mildly allergic measures like keeping them out of the bedrooms at all times might help.  If you have a major allergy I think you would know about it. — Five Cats

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Unfortunately, most allergists were or are allergic themselves; that’s how they became interested in the field. As so many of them were not allowed pets when they were children, they are not aware of the nature of the relationship we have with pets, and are capable of broadcasting such advice without regard to a particular patient’s specific allergies. When you are selecting a new allergist, call the office and ask the clerk if her doctor owns a pet. Go to one who does. I think we go about this the wrong way. Lots of folks want to have pet animals. The issue should be which species are least likely to cause allergic reactions in most people. I guess that any animal with dander (which means furry mammals) can cause allergic reactions in some people. But I’ll bet these are probably safe for most people: – Turtles – Reptiles – Tropical Fish – Ants (many children love to watch ant farms)

These are all quite specialist animals to keep and can have very long lifespans.  This is also missing the point about some of the pleasures of cats – I’m sure a turtle isn’t as nice to stroke and I’m damned sure they doesn’t purr.   It probably is also rather hard to teach them tricks, one of the fun bits of dog-owning, and they don’t need daily walks which is one of the best bits of owning dogs – getting out each day, meeting people and getting a bit of exercise. Do many asthmatics have problems with birds (parakeets, parrots, etc.)??

Some certainly do, and many birds are also quite specialist to keep. Not only that – many parrots live 50 years or more. — Five Cats

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I went through years of allergy shots so that I could once again own cats.   Colin, this is one of the very few times that I think you have plunged into the same non-rationality that typifies so many of the quacks you denounce so often. Cats aren’t worth risking your health. Cats aren’t worth anything.

 Steve, there are people out there who feel what you might think of as irrational attachment for their religion, ethnicity, nation, sexual orientation, University, rock climbing, cat or dog, or thimble collecting. Some of these attachments, these devotions, can cause life-long discomfort, and even death. Your statement that cats aren’t worth anything betrays an attitude in yourself toward other people’s value judgements that I don’t believe you would want labeled.      Larry

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My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it.

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I still have my cat. I have used that product named Aller-Pet. It does help somewhat. Doesn’t get rid of the issue but helps. I also have an air cleaner going on all floors of my home at all times. I won’t get rid of my cat and will probably have another after this one. Denise — Cowards die many times before their deaths; The valiant never taste of death but once. -Shakespeare-

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it.

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I’ve had asthma for atleast 30 years or more and I also have had cats since 1966 and I am now on my 3rd one and my cat dosen’t trigger my asthma problem and I won’t get rid of him. My allergist said to get rid of the cat, but I won’t get rid of him. BBOOTH

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Yes, I have tested positive for cats and take allergy shots every three weeks. I’m not conscious of them bothering me though. Other allergens cause me a very noticeable and immediate reaction.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it. You don’t say whether you were allergy tested and tested positive to cat dander… if not then your know-nothing doctor is just being a pompous shit. Sheldon "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

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if you have been tested find out which serum was used! not all cats have all chemicals that cause allergies.  my cats don’t bother me, but if tested with PHD (pelt, hair, dander) serum it is my worst reaction.  if tested with serum from other company, which is only saliva i don’t react.  all cats have chemical in their saliva.  not all cats have all the other chemicals. also, there are treatments to reduce allergens on cat and on furniture.  try dr foster catalog or web site. sorry don’t remember url.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My doctor has again gotten aggressive regarding the need for me to get rid of my two cats. I know he has a point but my wife and I love our cats. Would be interested in hearing from people who have benefited from pet removal and also from those of you who are living with pets and how you are dealing with it.

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Cat dander IS very special. It’s very small, very sticky, and it’s effect lasts a long time. I agree with the posts that have suggested people being allergic to the protein in saliva. Actually, it’s all about proteins. Some people react more to grass pollen than tree pollen. So it is with pets. One could be very allergic to cats and not at all to dogs. Weird. But, I didn’t make the rules… But, as a final note… I’ve been here a while and have posted a similar message… put aside your emotional tie to fluffy (or whatever) and think about the permanent lung damage you’re doing to yourself or your child… trust me… they WON’T thank you later.

Thank you for your support in my decision to put my cats outside.  They have been outside for a very short time, and I have had some emotions about it.  I realize now that they are actually happy!!!  My husband is adjusting, but I am feeling much better!         Suzanne

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That is great, Suzanne….and speaking of personal experience…I had a cat who would rather have been dead then give up the outside life…on days when I thought the weather was too severe for my fiance’s cat (who was an outside cat, while I had an inside cat), she would literally mope around the house.  I finally let my pampered kitty join her and they were very happy outside. We no longer have the original cats as they have passed on, but I wish we lived somewhere where our cats could live outdoors.  Unfortunately, we live right on one of the few busy streets around here:). Yana

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I, too, have thought of having an "outdoor only" pet. Just keep in mind (if you do)… animal dander can stick to your skin and clothing… so… wash before you go to bed and wash your clothes… don’t leave them on the floor of the bedroom (that’s piggy!).

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I think that over time, you become de-sensitized to the cats that you have.  You are still allergic to cats that are not familiar. does that sound odd? Sarah I have always had a strong allergic reaction to cats. <snip  I never

touch a cat.  Anyone ever have this experience or know anything about it? Alan Hi Alan, I am allergic to cats as well. I was suprised to find that I didn’t have any reaction to the three cats I now have.

I cann’t explain why the cats I – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – have don’t give me any reaction but I am happy about it. Paul Tyson

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I have always had a strong allergic reaction to cats. <snip  I never touch a cat.  Anyone ever have this experience or know anything about it? Alan

Hi Alan, I am allergic to cats as well. I was suprised to find that I didn’t have any reaction to the three cats I now have. The mother was a stray that found her way into my gradge and had a small liter.  They are now over a year old. All three have long hair. The reaction I got and still get from other cats is fairly strong. Eyes swelling shut lips swelling and my chest tightening etc. I cann’t explain why the cats I have don’t give me any reaction but I am happy about it. Oh yes I don’t bath them as my specialist suggested I do if I was to keep them. Paul Tyson

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have always had a strong allergic reaction to cats. <snip  I never touch a cat.  Anyone ever have this experience or know anything about it? Alan Hi Alan, I am allergic to cats as well. I was suprised to find that I didn’t have any reaction to the three cats I now have. The mother was a stray that found her way into my gradge and had a small liter.  They are now over a year old. All three have long hair. The reaction I got and still get from other cats is fairly strong. Eyes swelling shut lips swelling and my chest tightening etc. I cann’t explain why the cats I have don’t give me any reaction but I am happy about it. Oh yes I don’t bath them as my specialist suggested I do if I was to keep them. Paul Tyson

My son is extremely allergic to cats. If we spend 10 minutes or more in a house where a cat lives, I can almost guarantee that we’ll be visiting the emergency room later that day. He has a severe asthma attack about 1/2 hour after exposure. It’s very hard to keep a three-year-old away from animals; "he likes me Mommy, so I’m not tallergic!" My husband has the same asthma reaction to cats, but he can usually recover within a few days just by using his inhalers and nebuliser. My other son just gets the itchy, swollen eyes and uncontrollable sneezing. Mary

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Oh… I’m deathly allergic to guinea pigs (well, not deathly, but they’re horrible on me) but I think they’re a little easier to contain and/or seperate from an alergic person than cats…  Besides, when I moved in with my wife, her guinea pig had to go, but she wasn’t nearly as attached to it as people tend to get to cats. I’m allergic to rats too, for that matter, most small and fuzzy things are pretty hard on me, doubly so if they live in wood shavings.                                 -Brian

: Why is that people seem to be exclusively allergic to cats and never : mention dogs or guinea pigs, etc.?

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Cat dander IS very special. It’s very small, very sticky, and it’s effect lasts a long time. I agree with the posts that have suggested people being allergic to the protein in saliva. Actually, it’s all about proteins. Some people react more to grass pollen than tree pollen. So it is with pets. One could be very allergic to cats and not at all to dogs. Weird. But, I didn’t make the rules… But, as a final note… I’ve been here a while and have posted a similar message… put aside your emotional tie to fluffy (or whatever) and think about the permanent lung damage you’re doing to yourself or your child… trust me… they WON’T thank you later.

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I have always had a strong allergic reaction to cats.  However some, I noticed, did not bother me very much.  There’s also the psychological possibility but that’s unlikely because I’ve sometimes found a cat was present BECAUSE of my reaction.  I was told that age of the cats had something to do with it.  Up to a certain age they are/are not a problem then the situation reverses.  I can see no reason why this would be the case.  I never touch a cat.  Anyone ever have this experience or know anything about it?   Alan

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have always had a strong allergic reaction to cats. <snip  I never touch a cat.  Anyone ever have this experience or know anything about it? Alan Hi Alan, I am allergic to cats as well. I was suprised to find that I didn’t have any reaction to the three cats I now have. The mother was a stray that found her way into my gradge and had a small liter.  They are now over a year old. All three have long hair. The reaction I got and still get from other cats is fairly strong. Eyes swelling shut lips swelling and my chest tightening etc. I cann’t explain why the cats I have don’t give me any reaction but I am happy about it. Oh yes I don’t bath them as my specialist suggested I do if I was to keep them. Paul Tyson

Hi Paul: Knowing nothing about cats I wasn’t aware they were ever bathed.  It’s an interesting piece of information and perhaps it explains why there’s some I’m not allergic to.   They can be cute little companions and I’m gald your "happy about it." Alan

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I am highly allergic to guinea pigs and rabbits…more so than to cats even…so I don’t know.  I can live with cats, but not the other two. My doctor told me that cats licking themselves is the cause of dander…that dried saliva is really what we are reacting to, I don’t know if this is true or not and would not explain why I am allergic to rabbits and guinea pigs:):).   I am not allergic to dogs, either.

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Why is that people seem to be exclusively allergic to cats and never mention dogs or guinea pigs, etc.?

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Why is that people seem to be exclusively allergic to cats and never mention dogs or guinea pigs, etc.?

Cats seem to have a protein in their saliva which activates a lot of allergies, primarily because they groom their coats a lot. We lost our much beloved kitty last winter to cancer, and I’m having a hard time explaining to my 10 year old son that we probably will not have another cat.  He’s reactive to cats, and it was really hard on him and the cat when he was first diagnosed because the cat used to put him to bed as part of the regular bedtime routine (to the point of meowing demandingly if we were late about it).  He was 7 at the time while kitty was 10, and it was heartbreaking to see how sad both of them were. Part of the joy of a cat (for me) is the cuddles, and outdoor cat isn’t a good option because we live in a city.  Our last cat was an indoor/outdoor cat, but he had a small and well-defined range which wasn’t a problem.  Right now we have a roving neighbor cat who was our cat’s best friend who has adopted us as occasional "petting friends." That’s going to be it right now. jrw

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Hi There. I have question regarding cats and asthma. I had cats for three years. When I broke up with my girlfriend, she took the cats. During those three years I was sometimes asthma free and sometimes had asthma. In fact I would go months at a time with no asthma symptoms at all. I therefore concluded that, what ever was causing my asthma, it wasn’t the cats. Does this logic sound correct? Or is there more to cat allergy than meets the eye? The reason I ask, is that my girlfriend now has a roommate who hates cats and I may be getting them back soon. Thanks, Dave Ford

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Hi There. I have question regarding cats and asthma. I had cats for three years. When I broke up with my girlfriend, she took the cats. During those three years I was sometimes asthma free and sometimes had asthma. In fact I would go months at a time with no asthma symptoms at all. I therefore concluded that, what ever was causing my asthma, it wasn’t the cats. Does this logic sound correct? Or is there more to cat allergy than meets the eye? The reason I ask, is that my girlfriend now has a roommate who hates cats and I may be getting them back soon.

I would get allergy testing done to confirm a lack of cat allergy.   No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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Or is there more to cat allergy than meets the eye?

Specific allergies can come and go. For instance, I used to be severely allergic to eggs, now I’m not and can eat them with no problems. I was allergic to cats and dogs for a long time, took allergy shot for a few years and then wasn’t allergic to them. A while later I became allergic to them again. The reason I ask, is that my girlfriend now has a roommate who hates cats and I may be getting them back soon.

The best way to find out if you are allergic to cats is to find an allergist and get tested.

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I would get allergy testing done to confirm a lack of cat allergy.

I agree. Remember that allergies can develop over time, so even if you never noticed any problem with the cats before, living with them may have exacerbated any sensitivity to a point where you *will* have a problem, either now or eventually. I had cats for years and got along just fine. Didn’t even have asthma during those years. Then suddenly I had to go to the ER for an asthma attack, and subsequent testing showed a marked allergy to cats. Now I avoid them altogether — never visit in a home that has cats, or has even recently had cats — although I do enjoy them. Just my $.02 worth. Emily — Knit a hug, crochet a cuddle, sew a smile. http://www.newbornsinneed.org

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During allergy testing I had a positive response to cat allergen however I have three cats (indoors) and they don’t bother me (I’ve had them for 14 years).  My allergist said that one may become desensitized to their own pets, but other cats don’t bother me either although they did as a child (seemingly a long time ago).

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Does anyone know how I can keep cats away from my pond. Recently a cat has found my pond and keeps knocking stones into the pond as it is walking around the edge…. Any Help will be greatly appreciated… Thanks Jason Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know how I can keep cats away from my pond. Recently a cat has found my pond and keeps knocking stones into the pond as it is walking around the edge…. Any Help will be greatly appreciated… Thanks Jason Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

find the owners and call animal control. if any fish are killed by the cat,the owners are liable for all damages after being warned. you did have a $1000.00 fish right? —   KenCo Fish & Supplies ICQ # 1028648 ph/fax 401-781-9642   Shipping plants/fish a specialty.  Permalon pond liner dist.   Imported Koi,Goldfish,Tropicals,Piranhas,Stingrays etc.

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Hi Jason: Keep a spray bottle or water gun handy and when you see the kitty give it a squirt of water.  They HATE that and, being the clever creatures they are, will soon learn to avoid your pond. Don’t worry about the cat catching any of your fish. It WOULD NOT happen.  They aren’t very good fishermen…ooops…sorry…fisherpersons…*s* – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know how I can keep cats away from my pond. Recently a cat has found my pond and keeps knocking stones into the pond as it is walking around the edge…. Any Help will be greatly appreciated… Thanks Jason Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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Try some dog hair around the ponds borders.  If they smell the sent of another animal they may not return. (thinking your yard is another animals territory.)  They are hard to get rid of once they find your pond. Good luck getting rid of that pest. -Bob

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Hi Jason: Keep a spray bottle or water gun handy and when you see the kitty give it a squirt of water.  They HATE that and, being the clever creatures they are, will soon learn to avoid your pond.

you can only yell,squirt,hose and/or throw stuff at them for so long, paintballs keep them from returning people who let cats roam free should be fined like dog owners w/ leash laws. Don’t worry about the cat catching any of your fish. It WOULD NOT happen.  They aren’t very good fishermen…ooops…sorry…fisherpersons…*s*

—   KenCo Fish & Supplies ICQ # 1028648 ph/fax 401-781-9642   Shipping plants/fish a specialty.  Permalon pond liner dist.   Imported Koi,Goldfish,Tropicals,Piranhas,Stingrays etc.

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Don’t worry about the cat catching any of your fish. It WOULD NOT happen.  They aren’t very good fishermen…ooops…sorry…fisherpersons…*s*

Sorry to disagree. MY cats are good at that, they got one of my goldfish  This was before the pond got its dense cover of lily pads and floating plants. Now they just cannot reach at the fish because they can’t see them… No fish lost in the past 2 months or so, and a baby goldfish soon replaced the lost one  Now I try to keep the entire pond edge covered with lily pads and marginals. -Ivo Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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We had what we thought was heron or racoon injury to one of our fish, but after getting a large racoon trap at a rental store, 2 nights later we caught a feral cat that had been pooping in our yard for over a year.  We took it to the humane society.  The lily pads were sliced where it had tried to move them aside to get to the fish, nice clean cat sized slices. Since we got rid of that cat, we have had no other fish injury or missing fish.  No more shreaded lily pads. I think cats ARE good fisherman and agree about people being fined for not keeping their cats at home.  I realize that cats roam, but if it’s not acceptable for my dog, goat, chickens, or kids to roam and damage my neighbor’s property, then it ought not be acceptable for their cats to run free and wreck havoc! wendy in Oregon

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i have hears if you sprinkle pepper around the pound they don’t like the smell but you have to reapply it after it rains www.geocities.com/fooomis

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You might want to arrange the rocks so they don’t fall in. I have quite a few cats, but only Rita has been able to snag a goldfish. The pond has rocks here and there, and once in a while a raccoon drops a rock in. I catch all "feral" cats, haul ‘em to vet and neuter them. My neighbors have discovered their cats have had surgery, but if they live in my garage for a few months, eat my cat food, I neuter ‘em. Shame on those cat owners who allow their pets to reproduce, very costly. Much cheaper to neuter them, than have to neuter the kittens, etc and on and on. Way too much cruelty to dogs and cats…. always neuter, even if they aren’t yours, take the responsibility and just do it! Nothing you can really do, but even old Helen gets bored at watching the fish. However, save the cat manure! dig it into the dirt around the trees and plants, my cannas ate 6 feet high, absolutely luxurious solely because of animal manure and lots of water. My grandmother always used this as fertilizer, works great. Sue – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone know how I can keep cats away from my pond. Recently a cat has found my pond and keeps knocking stones into the pond as it is walking around the edge…. Any Help will be greatly appreciated… Thanks Jason Got questions?  Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. Up to 100 minutes free! http://www.keen.com

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However, save the cat manure! dig it into the dirt around the trees and plants, my cannas ate 6 feet high, absolutely luxurious solely because of animal manure and lots of water. My grandmother always used this as fertilizer, works great.

If you are pregnant, HIV positive, immune supressed or taking any immune suppressants stay away from cat poop!! ~Tina See my pond: http://members.aol.com/KrissyJo/ponds.html Akron, Ohio http://arthritisinsight.com Knowledge is power…support is essential.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You might want to arrange the rocks so they don’t fall in. I have quite a few cats, but only Rita has been able to snag a goldfish. The pond has rocks here and there, and once in a while a raccoon drops a rock in. I catch all "feral" cats, haul ‘em to vet and neuter them. My neighbors have discovered their cats have had surgery, but if they live in my garage for a few months, eat my cat food, I neuter ‘em. Shame on those cat owners who allow their pets to reproduce, very costly. Much cheaper to neuter them, than have to neuter the kittens, etc and on and on. Way too much cruelty to dogs and cats…. always neuter, even if they aren’t yours, take the responsibility and just do it! Nothing you can really do, but even old Helen gets bored at watching the fish. However, save the cat manure! dig it into the dirt around the trees and plants, my cannas ate 6 feet high, absolutely luxurious solely because of animal manure and lots of water. My grandmother always used this as fertilizer, works great. Sue

Sue:  You are a good woman.  I’m proud of you. vern Please visit my ponds at:  http://www.webpak.net/~vrolson

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you can only yell,squirt,hose and/or throw stuff at them for so long, paintballs keep them from returning Don’t worry about the cat catching any of your fish. It WOULD NOT happen.  They aren’t very good fishermen…ooops…sorry…fisherpersons…*s*

I must get some for my kitties, they would love it.  *s* – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text —  KenCo Fish & Supplies ICQ # 1028648 ph/fax 401-781-9642  Shipping plants/fish a specialty.  Permalon pond liner dist.  Imported Koi,Goldfish,Tropicals,Piranhas,Stingrays etc.

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This came from another group but it seemed pertinent given the way things have been going of late.  *s* In the interest of promoting a kindler and gentler rec. gardens, I am reposting pertinent sections of the OFFICIAL REC.PONDS  ANTI-FAQ [sections deleted] 1.3  WHAT SHOULD I DO WHEN I SEE A POST I DON

Question:

In article <Pine.GSO.3.96.990915214307.17773B-100…@elaine29.Stanford.EDU>, Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote: >I assume I’d need a prescription for Atarax. How would I go about getting >that?? >Thanks >Renee

I would think you might try the usual way that people obtain prescriptions.     Lp

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[ heavily edited to get the discussion into the order it   happened - please put quotes *before* your reply ] lpre…@provide.net (Larry Preuss) writes: > "Adelle Stavis" <Nospamcuthbert…@mediaone.net> wrote: >> Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote: >>> I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I >>> know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a >>> reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up >>> at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any >>> immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or >>> corn products.

A sizable dose of sodium bicarbonate can sometimes prevent a reaction like this if you take it immediately before or after eating the offending food.  Another substance with similar effects is potassium iodide (usually supplied as a supersaturated solution) but this is rather too toxic to use without getting medical advice first.  Both of these approaches have the problem that they also knacker your absorption of most useful nutrients from what you’ve just eaten, so they are not something to be used regularly. >> My standby is Atarax > Atarax (hydroxazine) originally came on the market as a tranquillizer. > Unfortunately, it is a poor one. Shortly after it became available it was > noticed that it had a marked antihistamine effect, particularly on the > skin. Doctors began to use it as a premium drug in the treatment of hives. > Once this usage became common the maker came to the conclusion that > attempting to have the FDA recognize it as an antihistamine would be more > expensive than it was worth, as the cat was out of the bag anyway. It is > still listed in the PDR primarily as a tranquillizer, though its value in > the treatment of itching is noted.

Spelt "hydroxyzine" in the UK; another brand here is Ucerax, but that one isn’t prescribable under the NHS because it’s more expensive.  The British National Formulary lists it as primarily for itching and secondarily for anxiety, so maybe it went through different regulatory precedures here. It’s sold under about 40 other brand names around the world, including the cute Japanese "Bobsule" and the remarkably menacing "Ulgrax", which sounds to me like a baddie in a computer game. The one caution suggested by the manufacturer’s data sheet is that it can intensify the effects of alcohol or other sedative/depressant drugs.  This might well be an issue if (as is often likely to be the case) your food accident was at a social gathering; i.e. even if your blood alcohol is within the legal limit it might not be safe to drive. —> email to "jc" at this site: email to "jack"  or "bogus" will bounce <— Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html  food intolerance data and recipes, freeware logic fonts for the Macintosh, and Scots traditional music resources

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On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 14:46:30 -0700, Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote: >I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I >know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a >reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up >at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any >immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or >corn products. Thanks

First off, don’t ’slip up’.  Be vigilant in eliminating them from your diet.  Anaphylaxis is NOT pretty or fun! Second, there are a number of very good anti-itch medications.  Ask your doctor for a prescription to an appropriate one. Chris Owens

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My standby is Atarax (I’ve been told by a friend it’s not an antihistimine you want to take often because of side affects, but haven’t asked a Dr. about it yet, haven’t had the need). The only time I’ve had intense itching last more than an hour has been from contact allergies which cause a rash, so I also use a Nivea and Cortisone lotion. Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message

news:Pine.GSO.3.96.990915144410.22727A-100000@elaine7.Stanford.EDU… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I > know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a > reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up > at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any > immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or > corn products. Thanks >   ~*~*~*~*~* >           Renee Canada > laver…@leland.stanford.edu >     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ >    My Place Under the Sun- > http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821 >     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

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I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or corn products. Thanks                                  ~*~*~*~*~*                                 Renee Canada                         laver…@leland.stanford.edu                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~                            My Place Under the Sun-                 http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

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Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> writes: > i just wanted to publicly ask pardon for my apparently ridiculous question > about wondering how I’d get a prescription for this medicine to combat > itching. I don’t feign to know all about the medical field, so I wasn’t > sure I could just get a doctor to prescribe a tranquilizer for an > allergic reaction just because I heard it might help from this newsgroup.

There are only a few drugs prescribed for acute itching, Atarax is one of them, and acute itching is what you’ve got, so why not?  Might be an an idea to look it up in the official drug reference book for your state or country first, though. But: this is dealing with the problem very far down the chain of cause and effect.  Not eating the foods that cause the reaction is better; a bit further on, you can try to stop the reaction before it starts with either sodium bicarbonate or SSKI (potassium iodide).  This may or may not work, but the problem with expecting to treat the itching symptoms as they arise is that sometime you might suddenly have a lot more than that to deal with, and a mild anti-histamine drug like Atarax might not be quick or effective enough. —> email to "jc" at this site: email to "jack"  or "bogus" will bounce <— Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760 http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html  food intolerance data and recipes, freeware logic fonts for the Macintosh, and Scots traditional music resources

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Thanks for your sarcasm, as usual. I wasn’t sure if a regular doctor could just give it to me since it’s a tranquilizer. On Thu, 16 Sep 1999, Larry Preuss wrote: > In article > <Pine.GSO.3.96.990915214307.17773B-100…@elaine29.Stanford.EDU>, Renee > <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote: > >I assume I’d need a prescription for Atarax. How would I go about getting > >that?? > >Thanks > >Renee > I would think you might try the usual way that people obtain prescriptions. >     Lp

                                 ~*~*~*~*~*                                 Renee Canada                         laver…@leland.stanford.edu                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~                            My Place Under the Sun-                 http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Response:

i just wanted to publicly ask pardon for my apparently ridiculous question about wondering how I’d get a prescription for this medicine to combat itching. I don’t feign to know all about the medical field, so I wasn’t sure I could just get a doctor to prescribe a tranquilizer for an allergic reaction just because I heard it might help from this newsgroup. It may seem a dumb question, but I didn’t know the answer so I’d rather appear dumb for a second to get the knowledge. Thanks                                  ~*~*~*~*~*                                 Renee Canada                         laver…@leland.stanford.edu                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~                            My Place Under the Sun-                 http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Response:

I assume I’d need a prescription for Atarax. How would I go about getting that?? Thanks Renee – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -On Wed, 15 Sep 1999, Larry Preuss wrote: > Atarax (hydroxazine) originally came on the market as a tranquillizer. > Unfortunately, it is a poor one. Shortly after it became available it was > noticed that it had a marked antihistamine effect, particularly on the > skin. Doctors began to use it as a premium drug in the treatment of hives. > Once this usage became common the maker came to the conclusion that > attempting to have the FDA recognize it as an antihistamine would be more > expensive than it was worth, as the cat was out of the bag anyway. It is > still listed in the PDR primarily as a tranquillizer, though its value in > the treatment of itching is noted. Atarax is usually given in doses of > 25mg, but in the 10mg dose it is almost as effective for itching, and > seldom causes sedation, as the 25mg dose often does. No unusual long-term > bad side-effects have been noted from its use, and there are many people > around who have used it for 25 years. >     Larry   > In article <JVVD3.21999$P72.380…@wbnws01.ne.mediaone.net>, "Adelle > Stavis" <Nospamcuthbert…@mediaone.net> wrote: > >My standby is Atarax (I’ve been told by a friend it’s not an antihistimine > >you want to take often because of side affects, but haven’t asked a Dr. > >about it yet, haven’t had the need). The only time I’ve had intense itching > >last more than an hour has been from contact allergies which cause a rash, > >so I also use a Nivea and Cortisone lotion. > >Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message > >news:Pine.GSO.3.96.990915144410.22727A-100000@elaine7.Stanford.EDU… > >> I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I > >> know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a > >> reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up > >> at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any > >> immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or > >> corn products. Thanks > >>   ~*~*~*~*~* > >>           Renee Canada > >> laver…@leland.stanford.edu > >>     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ > >>    My Place Under the Sun- > >> http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821 > >>     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

                                 ~*~*~*~*~*                                 Renee Canada                         laver…@leland.stanford.edu                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~                            My Place Under the Sun-                 http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821                             ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Response:

In article <5…@purr.demon.co.uk>, bo…@purr.demon.co.uk (bogus address) wrote: >A sizable dose of sodium bicarbonate can sometimes prevent a reaction >like this if you take it immediately before or after eating the offending >food.  Another substance with similar effects is potassium iodide (usually >supplied as a supersaturated solution) but this is rather too toxic to use >without getting medical advice first.  Both of these approaches have the >problem that they also knacker your absorption of most useful nutrients >from what you’ve just eaten, so they are not something to be used regularly.

In olden days of asthma treatment, SSKI (saturated solution of potassium iodide), taken in doses of 10 drops four times a day, was a rather standard medication used to liquify mucus. It never seemed to interfere with nutrition, or be of any benefit in preventing allergic reactions. — Larry Preuss Ann Arbor, MI USA

Response:

Atarax (hydroxazine) originally came on the market as a tranquillizer. Unfortunately, it is a poor one. Shortly after it became available it was noticed that it had a marked antihistamine effect, particularly on the skin. Doctors began to use it as a premium drug in the treatment of hives. Once this usage became common the maker came to the conclusion that attempting to have the FDA recognize it as an antihistamine would be more expensive than it was worth, as the cat was out of the bag anyway. It is still listed in the PDR primarily as a tranquillizer, though its value in the treatment of itching is noted. Atarax is usually given in doses of 25mg, but in the 10mg dose it is almost as effective for itching, and seldom causes sedation, as the 25mg dose often does. No unusual long-term bad side-effects have been noted from its use, and there are many people around who have used it for 25 years.     Larry   In article <JVVD3.21999$P72.380…@wbnws01.ne.mediaone.net>, "Adelle – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Stavis" <Nospamcuthbert…@mediaone.net> wrote: >My standby is Atarax (I’ve been told by a friend it’s not an antihistimine >you want to take often because of side affects, but haven’t asked a Dr. >about it yet, haven’t had the need). The only time I’ve had intense itching >last more than an hour has been from contact allergies which cause a rash, >so I also use a Nivea and Cortisone lotion. >Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message >news:Pine.GSO.3.96.990915144410.22727A-100000@elaine7.Stanford.EDU… >> I had a question for you all regarding my reaction to food allergies. I >> know the best method is abstaining from the foods that can cause a >> reaction. In my case, the reaction is intense itching that can keep me up >> at night or wake me from sleep. I was wondering if anyone had any >> immediate remedies to itching if I do slip up and enjoy my wheat and/or >> corn products. Thanks >>   ~*~*~*~*~* >>           Renee Canada >> laver…@leland.stanford.edu >>     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ >>    My Place Under the Sun- >> http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821 >>     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Response:

It was perscribed for me as a matter of course, as if it were the set protocol for allergic dermatitis (also when I had chicken pox at 23). The harder part is proving you have the itchiness, i.e., getting the diagnosis in you records. Once that is done (if it hasn’t already), I imagine it wouldn’t be too difficult. Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote in message

news:Pine.GSO.3.96.990916165708.10027B-100000@elaine37.Stanford.EDU… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> i just wanted to publicly ask pardon for my apparently ridiculous question > about wondering how I’d get a prescription for this medicine to combat > itching. I don’t feign to know all about the medical field, so I wasn’t > sure I could just get a doctor to prescribe a tranquilizer for an > allergic reaction just because I heard it might help from this newsgroup. > It may seem a dumb question, but I didn’t know the answer so I’d > rather appear dumb for a second to get the knowledge. > Thanks >   ~*~*~*~*~* >           Renee Canada > laver…@leland.stanford.edu >     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ >    My Place Under the Sun- > http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/Backstage/8821 >     ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

Response:

On Thu, 16 Sep 1999 14:24:59 -0700, Renee <laver…@leland.Stanford.EDU> wrote: >Thanks for your sarcasm, as usual. I wasn’t sure if a regular doctor could >just give it to me since it’s a tranquilizer.

Any MD can prescribe any medication. Chris Owens

Response:

Question:

I’m sorry that you feel so let down by medicine. I agree that we should not put our faith entirely in conventional or other types of medication. However many more people live longer and more to the point, have disease free lives in the West due to this centuries advances in medicine and sanitation etc. The vast majority of Dr.’s and other related people are, in my experiece committed to improving care and are not part of a big conspirisy. Life is hard, yes, particularly if you have a chronic disease. Dr. Buteko believes that all people with asthma are hyperventilating, ie a condition set off by emotion, and all can be cured by breathing exercises taught for a fee only affordable to those fortunate enough to be well off. Though these breathing control exercises, which have been used for many years by physios and respiratory nurses are indeed useful in the control of asthma exacabations, they do not reverse broncoconstiction, inflammation of the airways, degranulation of mast cells and release of the symptom causing chemicals. Please, a little less heat and a little more light would be appreciated by those of us with asthma. Emotion doesn’t make for real augument, though I did enjoy your writing. My best regards to you. Andrew – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ——Original Message—– Newsgroups: alt.support.asthma

Response:

Lots of problems with this post!  Not the least of which is that it appears to be a clever back-door attempt to promote a specific asthma treatment.  I also have problems with the statement about "happily talking about the medication they take" and the banging the head against the wall analogy.  I can’t imagine anyone on this group getting some kind of cheap thrill from treating their asthma and I am sure that most of us would gladly throw away our medications if a miracle asthma cure were to come along.  We don’t do this stuff because we like it– we do it in order to breathe right. Finally, I would say that the rise in asthma morbidity is mostly influenced by the increase in air pollution, not the introduction of bronchodilators. That’s the fault of big business not the medical community.

Response:

I’m sorry that you feel so let down by medicine. I agree that we should not put our faith entirely in conventional or other types of medication. However many more people live longer and more to the point, have disease free lives in the West due to this centuries advances in medicine and sanitation etc. The vast majority of Dr.’s and other related people are, in my experiece committed to improving care and are not part of a big conspirisy. Life is hard, yes, particularly if you have a chronic disease. Dr. Buteko believes that all people with asthma are hyperventilating, ie a condition set off by emotion, and all can be cured by breathing exercises taught for a fee only affordable to those fortunate enough to be well off.

Many Buteyko users are self taught from information freely available on the internet. For a good introducing and more information on Buteyko try http://www.wt.com.au/~pkolb/buteyko.htm. It is best viewed by using the option to download the whole site and then read at leisure. There is quite a lot of it. See the ‘Get Started Now’ section, to get you started. It is completely free. Though these breathing control exercises, which have been used for many years by physios and respiratory nurses are indeed useful in the control of asthma exacabations, they do not reverse broncoconstiction, inflammation of the airways, degranulation of mast cells and release of the symptom causing chemicals.

The breathing exercises typically taught by physios and respiratory nurses are intended to increase the depth of breathing. Buteyko breathing aims to re-educate your body to breath less. Buteyko breathing does reverse broncoconstiction and inflammation of the airways. It also reduces the sensitivity to symptom causing chemicals. Please, a little less heat and a little more light would be appreciated by those of us with asthma. Emotion doesn’t make for real augument, though I did enjoy your writing. My best regards to you. Andrew

Norman

Response:

Buteyko breathing does reverse broncoconstiction and inflammation of the airways. It also reduces the sensitivity to symptom causing chemicals.

How? – are you telling us it now reverses airway remodelling? I can’t wait to see the proof for this one!

Response:

Sigh.  Man, they’re not even pretending to respect asthmatics anymore.  It’s like, blah blah blah, asthma incurable, blah blah blah, you’re all on drugs, blah blah blah, Buteyko.   Remember when they actually used some psuedo science? Woodinat Joel: What do you want for Christmas, Crow? Crow: I wanna decide who lives and who dies Joel: Oh, I don’t know…

Response:

with a title like that – i presume this guy is trying to provoke some kind of response for a reason. i must begin by stating that i am bemused by this posting – i have never seen such an offensive, inarticulate, badly spelt, asymmetric, generalisation devoid of fact and verifiable reference. he whines on about information asymmetry in a rather disjointed and ill-educated fashion, and yet clearly advocates it’s usage. i seriously doubt his ‘new emperor of the world’ would approve of his rantings either. does anyone know if he may have escaped from somewhere very secure and very padded where he may have perceived some kind of abuse from the medical profession? as far as critique goes – i really don’t know where to start – there’s so much and it’s far too easy. i’m sure others will pick out the various flaws involving alleged ‘cures’ and scientific rigour. so i would rather concentrate on the reason for targeting Australia – simply put – it was the only english speaking developed country that would entertain him. most of the individuals here that reply to buteyko postings have done their homework, they have researched not only the buteyko method, but the alternatives available – unlike the majority of buteyko samaritans or worse: soap-box preachers. they have come down on the side of common sense and the treatments (not cures – buteyko is not a cure) that are proven and work for the majority of the 150 million asthma sufferers worldwide. Mathew Pole – Why? Rich.

Response:

Hello,          Has anyone ever been feeling bad one day, I mean not specifically sick or tired, but run down?  

That happens a lot.  It is only serious when it keeps happening and there is no discernable cause AND eating right, getting plenty of water, exercise, and rest doesn’t cure it. The last thing that would or rather should occur to you is to go and see your G.P.

Why not?  That’s what I pay him for. The point I am getting at is that despite the apparent advances of modern medicine, there is still so much that they have no idea about.  

Well, yes; but considering that modern medicine is less than a century old, that isn’t all that surprising. The worse side of this of course is that if anyone else should happen to find any kind of assistance for the condition, they are firstly isolated by the medical community, then systematically reduced to nothing more than either a criminal trying to steal something that the doctors were about to release or a complete fraud.

What ARE you babbling on about?  New cures and treatments are introduced into practice every day.          Having been one of the medically desperate individuals of our community, waiting carefully on every word from my learned doctor, I can understand how it is so easy to allow this to continue.  But at the same time, it is so aggravating to read through this Discussion Group and consistently see responses by people happily talking about the amount of medication they take.  

Well, I wouldn’t say ‘happy’.  I would be delighted to take no medications at all.  However, I am equally delighted that medications which do treat my asthma effectively are available.  Without them, I wouldn’t have lived past my first day. It is unbearably close to the analogy of a person banging their head on a wall and then going to a doctor, being given pain killers so they may bang their heads even harder, until they get to be living on the edge of the pain barrier between the pills and the tremendous pain from the wall.  

No, it isn’t.  Why would you think that it is?          Why is it that although there is no direct, or all encompassing cause of asthma, well at least according to western medicine?  

There is no KNOWN cause.  Research continues into discovering the cause[s]. Why have all the suspected causes only ever come about since the invention of bronco-dialators?  

You aren’t really clear on how research occurs, are you? Why was asthma seen as self curing prior to bronco-dialators?  

No.          Well now for the really good stuff.  In around 1950, a gentleman named Dr. Buteyko in Russia was doing some research and happened to discover the cause of asthma.  

No, he didn’t.  Amongst other things, his science is ALL WRONG.  And, there is absolutely NO evidence that his soi-disant cure works. Chris Owens

Response:

         Why is it that although there is no direct, or all encompassing cause of asthma, well at least according to western medicine?

Maybe because that has not yet been discovered?  maybe because it does not exist?   Why have all the suspected causes only ever come about since the invention of bronco-dialators?  Why was asthma seen as self curing prior to bronco-dialators?  Yes, yes, you to can watch you doctor speak out an orifice that was not designed for speech, if you bother to ask these questions.

Actually, the bronchodilators came as a result of a greater understanding of asthma.  Just as every other (real) asthma treatment came as the result of actual scientific research into the nature of asthma and atopic disease. For example, the steroid medications were developed in response to the discovery that asthma is in fact an inflammatory disease of the airways, and the Singulair and Accolate were developed in response to the research into the mediator chemicals responsible for the late stage allergic response.          Well now for the really good stuff.  In around 1950, a gentleman named Dr. Buteyko in Russia was doing some research and happened to discover the cause of asthma.

Actually, he came up with a theory that was savaged by peer review. Rather than correct the flaws in the theory he started to ignore everything that is known about asthma since the actual facts did not support his theories. In the meantime scientific research into asthma, atopic disease and the functioning of the immune system advanced by leaps and bounds. However, since Mr. buteyko was so wedded to his theory that he was unwilling to re-examine it in light of new scientistic discoveries it ceased to be a discredited theory and became a belief system.           Well I think that this society is too happy to swallow any rubbish which is fed to it and doctors are just people like the rest of us, only they happen to have spent much less of their lives interacting with the general community, because they were always either studying or working in hospitals.  Anyway, we were all deprived of this information to the same degree, so if you claim to be ignorant of the facts, it is you own fault.  You should never have allowed anyone to control the information which controls your life.

You are absolutely correct!  We should all make sure that any treatment for asthma be based on sound scientific research and references that have been independently verified by the scientific community!  We should avoid any resource that is based on hype, poor science and misrepresentation – such as the butyeko supporters. Why don’t you go away and only come back when you have published scientific articles describing the effects of buteyko – where the authors did not 1) lie about the methodology and 2) conceal critical facts that would resulted in much less favorable conclusions? Why should we believe you when what you say has no scientific basis, and your supporters had to lie in order to get your sole supporting scientific article published? "Usenet is like a herd of performing elephants with diarrhea — massive, diffucult to redirect, awe-inspiring, entertaining, and a source of mind boggling amounts of excrement when you least expect it." Gene Spafford 1992

Response:

Hello,           Has anyone ever been feeling bad one day, I mean not specifically sick or tired, but run down?  The last thing that would or rather should occur to you is to go and see your G.P. (unless you are a hypercondriak, and then no one is sure what you are doing anyway!).  The point I am getting at is that despite the apparent advances of modern medicine, there is still so much that they have no idea about.  The worse side of this of course is that if anyone else should happen to find any kind of assistance for the condition, they are firstly isolated by the medical community, then systematically reduced to nothing more than either a criminal trying to steal something that the doctors were about to release or a complete fraud.           Having been one of the medically desperate individuals of our community, waiting carefully on every word from my learned doctor, I can understand how it is so easy to allow this to continue.  But at the same time, it is so aggravating to read through this Discussion Group and consistently see responses by people happily talking about the amount of medication they take.  It is unbearably close to the analogy of a person banging their head on a wall and then going to a doctor, being given pain killers so they may bang their heads even harder, until they get to be living on the edge of the pain barrier between the pills and the tremendous pain from the wall.  Would you consider this doctor to be a worthwhile member of the medical community or even of humanity at all.           Why is it that although there is no direct, or all encompassing cause of asthma, well at least according to western medicine?  Why have all the suspected causes only ever come about since the invention of bronco-dialators?  Why was asthma seen as self curing prior to bronco-dialators?  Yes, yes, you to can watch you doctor speak out an orifice that was not designed for speech, if you bother to ask these questions.           Well now for the really good stuff.  In around 1950, a gentleman named Dr. Buteyko in Russia was doing some research and happened to discover the cause of asthma.  Beyond this he also worked on and improved a cure for asthma.  No medication, no drugs, no hospital, you could really see how people used to grow out of it.  Anyway, given that the Russian medical body was about as open to new suggestions as the AMA it only took Dr. Buteyko about 30 years to get his cure approved, although by that time he had treated tens of thousands of patients successfully.  Then the iron curtain came down, but Dr. Buteyko was getting a bit to old to be bothered going on a world wide tour teaching the cure to asthma.  So he sent his best student, Alexander Stalmatski, and what country do you suppose they chose to start with, that’s right, Australia.  A country with freedom of speech, the worlds highest proportion of asthma  cases, and supposedly thousands of doctors desperately searching for the answer.  After being completely stonewalled by all the medical community, despite the fact the thousands of people were successfully treated in Australia, Alexander Stalmatski went to England.           Now there are those who would say that the Buteyko method was given a fair chance and that aspects of it were quite helpful.  But then again what was that I said about the medical community and the way everything happens to be a medical thought that gets stolen and released just before the doctors where about to tell us.  Yeah right.  So in this happy country, where, despite having been presented with the cure for asthma, we have an ever increasing asthma rate, rising deaths because of it and huge amounts of money being invested into research which we do not need.           But the fact that the Buteyko method doesn’t involve any medication.  No multi million dollar pharmasuticle industry is going to be supported by the Buteyko method.  How much does that fact affect the acceptance of the method?  If there was a magic pill or some marketable product, how different would the medical response be?  I really hate to ask these questions but there comes a point where you have to start asking some serious questions about what is going through the doctors minds when they fail to recognize the cure to asthma when it is presented to them on a plate, with a huge label saying "the cure for asthma!".  So who can tell us how american we are, how much money moves between the pharmasutical companies and the organizations who make the decisions about the treatment for asthma?            Well I think that this society is too happy to swallow any rubbish which is fed to it and doctors are just people like the rest of us, only they happen to have spent much less of their lives interacting with the general community, because they were always either studying or working in hospitals.  Anyway, we were all deprived of this information to the same degree, so if you claim to be ignorant of the facts, it is you own fault.  You should never have allowed anyone to control the information which controls your life.

Response:

Question:

Have you had PFT testing?  A Pulmonary Specialist will give you Pulmonary Function Testing which will let you know exactly what you have.  

Response:

when we took her in, the doc said she wasn’t wheezing at all. He couldn’t resolve that with her lousy peak flows, though, so we are continuing asthma treatment until he can gather more info on her could she be so tight that he can’t hear wheezing?  I don’t worry much as long as I wheeze, it is when I quit that I know I’m in trouble. Good luck to you. Angela Remember:  That which doesn’t break us makes us stronger.

 In my extensive experience with asthma, there are a LOT of doctors out there that don’t know how to diagnose it, how to treat it and how to teach a patient to cope with it. I nearly died before I found a family doctor who had the brains to handle my asthma.  I now head directly for the office within 48 hours of getting any URI because my track record is so bad with pneumonia. Sue "It was said she held a grudge until it died of old age, and then had it stuff and mounted…"                         David Weber

Response:

when we took her in, the doc said she wasn’t wheezing at all. He couldn’t resolve that with her lousy peak flows, though, so we are continuing asthma treatment until he can gather more info on her

could she be so tight that he can’t hear wheezing?  I don’t worry much as long as I wheeze, it is when I quit that I know I’m in trouble. Good luck to you. Angela Remember:  That which doesn’t break us makes us stronger.

Response:

Vicky,         I think every doctor my daughter has been to in the last eight years has told her the same things you describe. We know she is allergic to tree pollen, but has mild symptoms all year and horrendous episodes in spring and fall. She had a week of awful touch and go nights last week, but when we took her in, the doc said she wasn’t wheezing at all. He couldn’t resolve that with her lousy peak flows, though, so we are continuing asthma treatment until he can gather more info on her and understand better. Hope you and your son get some relief. : ) Ok, I have some strange asthma symptoms, not usually associated with the ailment.  I don’t usually wheeze, and when I am checked by my PCP he says he doesn’t understand how someone else could have diagnosed me as an asthmatic, I don’t seem to have the wheezing problems.  I cough a lot, especially if I get sick the cough stays for weeks.  I get sharp pains in my chest sometimes, feels like someone is stabbing me.  I do get short of breath on occasion. My son has the same symptoms, and they say he doesn’t have asthma either. He is also severely allergic to dust mites, just started the process of cleaning and mite-proofing the house.

–                                     Lisa ""When I dare to be powerful – to use my strength in the service of my vision, then it becomes less and less important whether I am afraid".                                                      -  Audre Lorde "14"     For El Gato Grande

Response:

Ok, I have some strange asthma symptoms, not usually associated with the ailment.  I don’t usually wheeze, and when I am checked by my PCP he says he doesn’t understand how someone else could have diagnosed me as an asthmatic, I don’t seem to have the wheezing problems.  I cough a lot, especially if I get sick the cough stays for weeks.  I get sharp pains in my chest sometimes, feels like someone is stabbing me.  I do get short of breath on occasion. My son has the same symptoms, and they say he doesn’t have asthma either. He is also severely allergic to dust mites, just started the process of cleaning and mite-proofing the house. Vicky A life with love will have some thorns, but a life without love will have no roses. <BOB code KIth- lWm EB!+ m5 CP B13 Ow Lb SC T+- A5 H6n b2 D++ </BOB code Vicky Dunbar

Response:

Question:

My daughter’s doctor prescribed a spirometer test every day, but my ex-wife says I need to get my own for when she comes to visit me. Disregarding how this is a pain in the rear, how variable are they in calibration?  What’s a good one for the money, and how much would that be?  Also, she’s been on Albuterol for a year now, and it appears to be an allergic reaction that kicks it off, but they haven’t tested her for any allergies.  Is this common?  There’s apparently been no work done at all on what triggers the attacks.  Is this a normal course of treatment? Steve H

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My daughter’s doctor prescribed a spirometer test every day, but my ex-wife says I need to get my own for when she comes to visit me. Disregarding how this is a pain in the rear, how variable are they in calibration?  What’s a good one for the money, and how much would that be?  Also, she’s been on Albuterol for a year now, and it appears to be an allergic reaction that kicks it off, but they haven’t tested her for any allergies.  Is this common?  There’s apparently been no work done at all on what triggers the attacks.  Is this a normal course of treatment? Steve H

Peak Flow Meters are used to measure lung function at home. The Assess and Mini-Wright are common brands. If she is under eight she would probably need the low-range model. Cost of an Assess PFM at Walgreen’s is under $25 I think; some states may require a prescription. It would be best to simply get another one like she already has; maybe have your ex get it and you reimburse her. There can be some variation between manufacturers. (Spirometers are used in doctor’s offices, cost $2,000 & up) If the albuterol inhaler is needed more than once a day it indicates the need for adding or increasing long-acting preventor meds, like a steroid inhaler. If she has allergies, these should be tested for so proper avoidance procedures can be used. (pollen, dust mites, animal dander, mold?) Irritants like smog, smoke, chemicals can trigger asthma, also cold dry air. A peak flow meter is usually used with an Action Plan. Action is taken when peak flows drop below 80% of personal best, like adding or increasing steroid inhalers. You also need to know when to take her to the emergency room or urgent care. Perhaps you should make an appointment to discuss your daughters asthma treatment with her doctor, or accompany her on her next visit. It would be best if your daughter brought her own peak flow meter with her and use yours as a back-up. Expecially the first time when you want to compare readings between the 2 meters. Ellis

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Lots of conflicting issues here.  Our 2 year old is off of dairy to help her asthma (it’s helped a LOT), and gets some calcium supplementation in her multivitamin.   1) How much magnesium supplement to you give a 30 pound toddler? and 2) Will the magnesium be clobbered by the calcium?

I have heard from one woman were taking calcium supplements worsened here asthma, so yes, it can throw the balance out. I wouldn’t be surprised if that is one of the reasons milk is bad, it has lots of calcium with little magnesium. How much for a 30 pounder? If adults are taking 400-800 mg (some take more — I wouldn’t) then I’d cut those to a fifth and come up with 100 mg. Such a size is available. Don.

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I`m just diagnosed. Sceptical to the use of drugs. If avoidable. What if I start taking them-and then- after some time- decide to quit? Back to starting point-or worse?

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I`m just diagnosed. Sceptical to the use of drugs. If avoidable. What if I start taking them-and then- after some time- decide to quit? Back to starting point-or worse?

Depends on what you are taking.  In general, asthmatics are placed on anti-inflamitory medications as a means of preventing asthma attacks. There are a number of ‘common-sense’ techniques that can aslo reduce your likelyhood of expierencing asthma attacks.  For example, find out what things you are allergic to and avoid them. Another thing is to discuss this issue with your doctor.  Make sure that he fully explains why you are taking a particular medication and what benefits  you should expect (and side effects to look out for). Go to ‘Yahoo’ or another search enging and do a keyword search using the ‘asthma’.  As you visit the various sites, write down a list of questions to ask your doctor on your next visit. The primary goal of asthma treatment is to allow you to live your normal life while expierencing the fewest asthma symptoms possible. Now, everybodys asthma is different so you will have to find out what you react to, and the best way of controling your symptoms.  Your doctor cannot do all the work for you.  You will have to help him by reporting to him the sucess/failure of the different techniques. The most important thing is to _always_ consult you doctor before making any changes to your treatment program.   ‘Reply to’ address changed to foil email spammers.

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I`m just diagnosed. Sceptical to the use of drugs. If avoidable. What if I start taking them-and then- after some time- decide to quit? Back to starting point-or worse?

Here’s a writeup on alternatives that I did: Newsgroup: alt.support.asthma I’m doing the Proventil thing, but I am interested in any info you all might have on alternative methods of clearing this asthma thing up.

I don’t think you’ll be able to get rid of it, but maybe you can control it to the point of not needing the Proventil. I have several things: (1) Give up dairy. There are many anecdotal reports saying that dairy worsens asthma. It also makes one more susceptible to colds, increases mucous, makes one (mostly kids) more susceptible to ear infections, and other related things. You should be able to find this info off this page of links:   The No Milk Page:   http://www.panix.com/~nomilk/ (2) Take magnesium supplements. This has had anecdotal reports here in this newsgroup, though not for a while. I have collected some and I can e-mail them to you. As for how much to take? I’d start with 400 mg and work up and see how it helps. I would not take more than 1600 mg/day tops. Here is a quote I found: From Wise Encyclopedia of Cookery, 1971: "Healthy lungs show twice as much magnesium as lime [i.e. calcium carbonate]. Magnesium is a cell-builder, particularly of the nervous system and lung tissues. Magnesium salts assist in reducing foreign matter and waste, and in carrying them out of the system, thus invigorating the excretory organs and producing pressure, without which metabolism would be impossible." Note that taking calcium will work against the magnesium. So don’t take it. http://www.noah.cuny.edu/ has a summary from a scientific journal (1995) suggesting that increased consumption of magnesium is very beneficial for asthmatics–preventing attacks or lessening their severity. (3) B-6: Newsgroups: alt.support.asthma In an experimental study 76 asthmatic children  given 200mg B6 a day demonstrated significant symptom improvement and reduction in dosage of bronchodilators. Ann. Allergy 35:93-7, 1975 Experimental controlled study: 7pts. and 6 controls received 50 mg B6 twice a day. All asthmatics reported a dramatic decrease in frequency, duration and severity of asthmatic attacks and wheezing ceased in about one week (Reynolds RD – ibid) Also considered to be possibly beneficial were, B12, vitamin C, magnesium and Omega-3 fatty acids. (4) Aerobic exercise. Depending on what shape you’re in now, you may have to start slowly with this. But the better shape you’re in, the better your asthma condition will be. The benefit of Garlic for an asthmatic is that Garlic is the most powerful; least painful expectorant on the planet. Nothing gets fluid and congestion out of lungs better. Three ways to use: 1. Garlic soup; tastes like beef bouillon, no garlic after taste. 2. Raw Garlic for children; poke a couple holes in a  raw clove of Garlic and put in water or juice. 3. Raw Garlic for adults; Put small raw clove of Garlic in mouth until mouth too hot to tolerate. We are a nutritionally-oriented association, emphasizing mineral nutrition. Our asthmatic members have reported significant results supressing asthmatic reactions using magnesium aspartate along with pyridoxal-5-phosphate, a metabolite of Vit. B-6. This is an accepted treatment for Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. Not everyone responded; however, over 75% did. The MgAsp formula was one we commissioned and the P-5-P was from Klaire Labs, Inc. of San Marcos, CA 92069 under their "Vital Life" label. (7) Avoid your triggers. They can be food or airborne ones. Everybody has different ones so it’s hard to list. My only one is cats, so by totally avoiding them I haven’t taken any Provential in years. If a cat owner throws a party I do not attend. I hope you find this quick summary useful, Don. And a response to it: Newsgroup: alt.support.asthma In regards to the use of Magnesium, one of the drugs that we use in hospital for severe attacks in the emergency room is Magnesium Sulfate (you may know it by the name Epsom Salts). Mag works as mentioned and it also will prolog the duration of the chemicals is the muscle cells of the breathing tubes to keep them relaxed, therefore keep them open longer. Hope I can be of assistance, Lee And we now have the NO-MILK mailing list up and running. To subscribe, send SUB NO-MILK YourFirstName YourLastName For more information, or for help with subscribing, write to the listowner:

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