Question:

Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role. Mark, MD Also, I have high blood pressure and am lisinopril with hctz.  Is a long-acting Beta-2 agonist appropriate for use by asthmatics with blood pressure problems? Cindi

It’s not good for an asthmatic to take a Beta-blocker.  Blocking the Beta receptors is the antithesis of Beta agonism (asthma treatment). Lucky for you, lisinopril is an ACE inhibitor, and not in the same class as propranolol or other Beta-blocker antihypertensives. Are you trying to trip me up?  You’re coming up with an awful lot of "interesting" questions… Mark, MD

Response:

see below Also, I have high blood pressure and am lisinopril with hctz.  Is a long-acting Beta-2 agonist appropriate for use by asthmatics with blood pressure problems? At normal doses it shouldn’t be a problem. At high doses the beta agonists can stimulate the heart and cause rapid heart rates but, presumably, in this situation you need them to keep you breathing. — CBI, MD

    CINDI…lets start from scratch here:  Age: Weight: Heigth, fat content??     SMOKER???  General diet???  etc…SOMETHINg is causing a possible     COPD syndrome??      You probably need  AMINO Acid therapy/INPUT??      Lets get on the black board and outline your physical self before we can isolate      or round up the herd of problems causing your condition?  B-0b1

Response:

Can you please tell me what exactly a leukotrine (? on spelling) modifier is and what it does?

Leukotrienes are chemicals that are involved in producing inflammation and seem to be important in at least some people’s asthma. Drugs that reduce them include Singulair, Accolate, and Zyflo. — CBI, MD

Response:

Also, I have high blood pressure and am lisinopril with hctz.  Is a long-acting Beta-2 agonist appropriate for use by asthmatics with blood pressure problems?

At normal doses it shouldn’t be a problem. At high doses the beta agonists can stimulate the heart and cause rapid heart rates but, presumably, in this situation you need them to keep you breathing. — CBI, MD

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t think so. They have always promoted it as steroid sparing and suggested that docs should add their product rather than increase the dose of steroid. I don’t think I have ever heard them comment on just using the Serevent – probably because it would not be a good idea but they don’t want to say anything that could dissuade use of their drug. My doctor does not have me on a steroid, either inhaled or oral, at all, but I am taking the Serevent diskus one puff two times a day, along with an albuterol inhaler as needed, and clarinex once a day for my allergies.  Should I also be on a steroid, either inhaled or oral.

From a recent letter from GSK (makers of Serevent) after the SMART trial was stopped prematurely: "In contrast to recommendations of current asthma management guidelines, there was a low level of inhaled corticosteroid use (47%) in the entire population in the SMART study. Only 50% of Caucasian patients were receiving treatment with an inhaled corticosteroid, and in African-American patients, only 38% were using inhaled corticosteroid therapy at baseline. In the total population of patients receiving inhaled corticosteroids at baseline, no significant differences were seen for primary events and asthma-related events, including deaths. However, in the total population of patients not receiving inhaled corticosteroids at baseline, there was a statistically significant greater number of asthma-related deaths in all patients taking salmeterol compared to those taking placebo." Full Letter:   http://www.fda.gov/medwatch/SAFETY/2003/serevent.htm — CBI, MD

Response:

I don’t think so. They have always promoted it as steroid sparing and suggested that docs should add their product rather than increase the dose of steroid. I don’t think I have ever heard them comment on just using the Serevent – probably because it would not be a good idea but they don’t want to say anything that could dissuade use of their drug.

My doctor does not have me on a steroid, either inhaled or oral, at all, but I am taking the Serevent diskus one puff two times a day, along with an albuterol inhaler as needed, and clarinex once a day for my allergies.  Should I also be on a steroid, either inhaled or oral. Cindi

Response:

Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role. Mark, MD

Can you please tell me what exactly a leukotrine (? on spelling) modifier is and what it does? Cindi

Response:

Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role. Mark, MD

Also, I have high blood pressure and am lisinopril with hctz.  Is a long-acting Beta-2 agonist appropriate for use by asthmatics with blood pressure problems? Cindi

Response:

Not exactly a groundbreaking revelation.  It’s been known for years that chronic overuse of bronchodilators can result in a downregulation of the production of new Beta 2 receptors.  That’s why recommendations are in place to medicate persistent asthmatics with leukotriene modifiers or inhaled corticosteroids, and reserve bronchodilators for episodic/rescue use. Duh. Mark, MD

Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)? Cindi

Response:

Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)?

Isn’t the manufacturer of Serevent recommending you not use it unless you’re also taking a steroid, now that they’ve found out it can sometimes make things worse?

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Not exactly a groundbreaking revelation.  It’s been known for years that chronic overuse of bronchodilators can result in a downregulation of the production of new Beta 2 receptors.  That’s why recommendations are in place to medicate persistent asthmatics with leukotriene modifiers or inhaled corticosteroids, and reserve bronchodilators for episodic/rescue use. Duh. Mark, MD Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)? Cindi

Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role. Mark, MD

Response:

Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)? Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role.

I use Advair now, but prior to my severe asthmatic death event in July, I was using Serevent alone when I felt things getting a bit out of hand rather than a steroid. I chose that for reasons I won’t go into, but I’m now reasonably convinced that the use of the Serevent exacerbated the situation for me when I had the serious attack because I was resistant to the albuterol as a result of taking it. Suffice it to say that I haven’t had a single asthma attack since I was released from the hospital on July 11, so the Advair is working very well for me. I *do* have a bit of concern about possible albuterol resistance from the Serevent component, and that’s something I plan to discuss with my pulmonologist the next time I see him. — Be well, Barbara (Julian [6], Aurora [4], and Vernon’s [19mo] mom) This week’s special at the English Language Butcher Shop: "Use repeatedly for severe damage." — Directions on shampoo bottle Daddy: You’re up with the chickens this morning. Aurora: No, I’m up with my dolls! All opinions expressed in this post are well-reasoned and insightful. Needless to say, they are not those of my Internet Service Provider, its other subscribers or lackeys. Anyone who says otherwise is itchin’ for a fight. — with apologies to Michael Feldman – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Mark, MD

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m not familiar with the two drugs you mentioned, but the data from growth studies do not apparently support the fears of growth restriction, at least WRT the inhaled corticosteroids used in children in the U.S. The essence of the concern is this:  patients who used one of the older inhaled steroids were studied because of the theoretical concern that long-term use might lead to growth restriction, as we already knew long term use of oral steroids can do. It was noted that over years of high-dose use of this product, there WAS growth restriction:  the kids were about 1/2 cm shorter than their matched peers.  (For those using English units, that’s about 1/5".) Subsequent inhaled steroids are absorbed even less than the older ones, resulting in little to no discernable change in growth. Moreover, even if the kids in the older study did lose 1/2 cm in height, their growth velocity increased when they stopped taking the steroids, and they regained the height they had "lost". The most important point, though, is this:  In the worst case scenario, your child might lose 1/2 cm in height…would you rather have that or a child who is at significantly higher risk of a life threatening asthma attack due to being treated with the wrong medicine? Remember, there are about 5,000 asthma-related deaths in the U.S. each year.  1/3 occur in those who had previously been categorized as "severe" asthmatics.  1/3 were "moderate" and 1/3 were previously considered "mild" asthmatics.  You don’t have to have a history of severe asthma attacks in order to have a fatal one. Mark, MD

Is this really a responsible attitude? The cause of asthma is not known. The extensive use of symptomatics does not seem to be balanced by sufficient basic research.  It seems quite likely that asthma is a functional disorder which becomes extremely difficult to reverse, see comments on damage to muscles due to attacks in Chest 1992, pages 1357-61. The situation in sports is grotesque with a 80% + diagnosis rate (whatever this means) in some disciplines. It is revolting to think of, say, figure skating being done  by pharmamonsters.  It would be better to switch over to robots or to Steven Spielberg at once. Forget the drug company shareholders for a bit and try to get some logical research done. Your argument, not to say fear mongering, about the primacy of medication justified by danger of attacks only holds good if you ignore techniques like that described by Professor Hillsman onhttp://www.ohiou.edu/isarp/conf_00/ind_papr.htm or properly performed pursed lips breathing. For practical purposes I find the following technique quite sufficient to keep on the good side of my asthmatic tendency without the need of any medication whatever. It is based on the thought that asthma involves hectic breathing which fails to comply with the time constants of lung deflation and inflation.   If one can time one’s breathing at will, an attack would seem to be impossible. Forcing the breathing rate to stay normal seems to be too difficult for most patients even if they were properly motivated. Step-synchronized breathing offers a solution because locomotion (walking, running) "entrains" breathing as a scientific effect.  It is comparatively easy to keep breathing regular if you take f. i. 3 steps to an inhale and 3 to an exhale. With such practice the exhale may extended more and more easily.  An attack is prevented if the exhale can be lengthened. Extending the number of steps per exhale and inhale to say 8 and 4 is also healthy for the reason of there being an incentive spirometer (like   a Volldyne) effect improving the vital capacity.  See material on "breathwalking" and "yoga walking" as healthy exercise. Richard Friedel.

Response:

Anti-Asthma Medications: Too Much of a Good Thing? Monday, August 18, 2003 Source – Journal of Clinical Investigation In an unusual paradox, asthmatics that are chronically treated with bronchodilating beta-agonist medications such as albuterol, ventolin, and salbutamol may ultimately develop increased sensitivity to airway constriction and experience exacerbation of their condition.

Not exactly a groundbreaking revelation.  It’s been known for years that chronic overuse of bronchodilators can result in a downregulation of the production of new Beta 2 receptors.  That’s why recommendations are in place to medicate persistent asthmatics with leukotriene modifiers or inhaled corticosteroids, and reserve bronchodilators for episodic/rescue use. Duh. Mark, MD

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – For my money, inhaled steroids are the best way to go for long-term "controller"-type medicines for asthma.  The actual absorbed dose for most of them is miniscule, so the concern about so-called steroid side effects is really non-existent.  According to the data (sorry, no ready reference at hand), the amount of systemically absorbed steroids from one 5-day burst of prednisone is the same as that absorbed by taking twice-daily puffs of inhaled steroids for about 200 years.  Not a bad trade-off. I’m sceptical about this view and it’s clear that many doctors beleive that some of the inhaled steroid become systemic, in quantities that can cause side-effects. For example, when my son was a toddler and suffering from severe asthma, he was switched from Becotide to Flixotide – then a very new drug – because of concerns about his growth being retarded because of steroids – the Flixotide supposedly had less systemic effect than Becotide (due to the different doses). I myself take a high dose of Flixotide (2000mcg per day) and my consultant reckons that it will be very hard for me to lose weight on that dose. Does anyone have any more information about this? Regards Chrissie

I’m not familiar with the two drugs you mentioned, but the data from growth studies do not apparently support the fears of growth restriction, at least WRT the inhaled corticosteroids used in children in the U.S. The essence of the concern is this:  patients who used one of the older inhaled steroids were studied because of the theoretical concern that long-term use might lead to growth restriction, as we already knew long term use of oral steroids can do. It was noted that over years of high-dose use of this product, there WAS growth restriction:  the kids were about 1/2 cm shorter than their matched peers.  (For those using English units, that’s about 1/5".) Subsequent inhaled steroids are absorbed even less than the older ones, resulting in little to no discernable change in growth. Moreover, even if the kids in the older study did lose 1/2 cm in height, their growth velocity increased when they stopped taking the steroids, and they regained the height they had "lost". The most important point, though, is this:  In the worst case scenario, your child might lose 1/2 cm in height…would you rather have that or a child who is at significantly higher risk of a life threatening asthma attack due to being treated with the wrong medicine? Remember, there are about 5,000 asthma-related deaths in the U.S. each year.  1/3 occur in those who had previously been categorized as "severe" asthmatics.  1/3 were "moderate" and 1/3 were previously considered "mild" asthmatics.  You don’t have to have a history of severe asthma attacks in order to have a fatal one. Mark, MD

Response:

As I understand it, the down-regulation of the Beta receptors is a short lived problem once you quit using Beta agonists too much. Well yes, but as long as you are still using the Serevent you haven’t quit.

And that is just what I told her:  salmeterol is a beta agonist and if she quits using it, the receptors come back. Mark, MD

Response:

I myself take a high dose of Flixotide (2000mcg per day) and my consultant reckons that it will be very hard for me to lose weight on that dose.

That is a very high dose and I am sure you are getting systemic effects. At this high a dose the appropriate comparison would be to oral prednisone, which you would surely otherwise be taking, rather than salmeterol. — CBI, MD

Response:

For my money, inhaled steroids are the best way to go for long-term "controller"-type medicines for asthma.  The actual absorbed dose for most of them is miniscule, so the concern about so-called steroid side effects is really non-existent.  According to the data (sorry, no ready reference at hand), the amount of systemically absorbed steroids from one 5-day burst of prednisone is the same as that absorbed by taking twice-daily puffs of inhaled steroids for about 200 years.  Not a bad trade-off.

I’m sceptical about this view and it’s clear that many doctors beleive that some of the inhaled steroid become systemic, in quantities that can cause side-effects. For example, when my son was a toddler and suffering from severe asthma, he was switched from Becotide to Flixotide – then a very new drug – because of concerns about his growth being retarded because of steroids – the Flixotide supposedly had less systemic effect than Becotide (due to the different doses). I myself take a high dose of Flixotide (2000mcg per day) and my consultant reckons that it will be very hard for me to lose weight on that dose. Does anyone have any more information about this? Regards Chrissie

Response:

For my money, inhaled steroids are the best way to go for long-term "controller"-type medicines for asthma.  The actual absorbed dose for most of them is miniscule, so the concern about so-called steroid side effects is really non-existent.  According to the data (sorry, no ready reference at hand), the amount of systemically absorbed steroids from one 5-day burst of prednisone is the same as that absorbed by taking twice-daily puffs of inhaled steroids for about 200 years.  Not a bad trade-off. I’m sceptical about this view and it’s clear that many doctors beleive that some of the inhaled steroid become systemic, in quantities that can cause side-effects.

I don’t think that anyone doubts that inhaled steroids can cause systemic effects. In the recommended range for most (especially the newer ones) a biochemical response can be measured but when clinical outcomes are examined (like height and weight) the effects are small. Of course, as the dose goes up the chances of side effects goes up as well. But that is not really what Mark said. He correctly described inhaled steroids as being the only agents with proof of slowing disease progression over the long term. It makes sense that efforts to control other contributing factors; like smoking, allergies, sinus disease, and reflux; should be undertaken to keep the dose of steroid down the lowest that is effective in order to minimize systemic effects. The roles of other drugs, such as Servent and leukotriene inhibitors, in helping to decrease the doses of steroids is still being defined. His point is that the asthma regimen starts with trigger avoidance and steroids and then builds from there. I don’t think you will find many credible docs basing their regimens on other drugs first with steroids second. — CBI, MD

Response:

Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)? Isn’t the manufacturer of Serevent recommending you not use it unless you’re also taking a steroid, now that they’ve found out it can sometimes make things worse?

I don’t think so. They have always promoted it as steroid sparing and suggested that docs should add their product rather than increase the dose of steroid. I don’t think I have ever heard them comment on just using the Serevent – probably because it would not be a good idea but they don’t want to say anything that could dissuade use of their drug. — CBI, MD

Response:

Isn’t the manufacturer of Serevent recommending you not use it unless you’re also taking a steroid, now that they’ve found out it can sometimes make things worse?

I haven’t heard anything about that – I’ll have to ask my dr about it the next time I have to go in. Cindi

Response:

As I understand it, the down-regulation of the Beta receptors is a short lived problem once you quit using Beta agonists too much.

Well yes, but as long as you are still using the Serevent you haven’t quit. — CBI, MD

Response:

<snip I *do* have a bit of concern about possible albuterol resistance from the Serevent component, and that’s something I plan to discuss with my pulmonologist the next time I see him.

It is a wise concern to have.  In my case, my Advair (more specifically the Serevent component) does reduce the effectiveness of the albuterol.  Because I’m active, I use the albuterol as a pre-exercise medication to keep the exacerbation down…problem is that if I catch a snoot full of cigarette smoke during the day, the albuterol doesn’t have enough left to keep me clear. Rather than a trip to the ER, I’ve been set-up with a neb and a atrovent/albuterol combo to overcome the problem. It works, but isn’t the most ideal. Just thought I’d putin my $0.02 worth, Michael Halliwell — Michael Halliwell To Reply: remove the "nospam"

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Is that the reason I have 2 inhalers, one that I use every 12 hours no matter how I feel (Serevent diskus) and one that I use only when I am in an active attack (albuterol)? Precisely…except that Serevent (salmeterol) is actually a long-acting Beta-2 agonist and is neither a steroid nor a leukotriene modifier.  I personally don’t prescribe salmeterol to my asthmatic patients;  I prefer the steroids and/or LMs for the "controller" role. I use Advair now, but prior to my severe asthmatic death event in July, I was using Serevent alone when I felt things getting a bit out of hand rather than a steroid. I chose that for reasons I won’t go into, but I’m now reasonably convinced that the use of the Serevent exacerbated the situation for me when I had the serious attack because I was resistant to the albuterol as a result of taking it. Suffice it to say that I haven’t had a single asthma attack since I was released from the hospital on July 11, so the Advair is working very well for me. I *do* have a bit of concern about possible albuterol resistance from the Serevent component, and that’s something I plan to discuss with my pulmonologist the next time I see him. — Be well, Barbara (Julian [6], Aurora [4], and Vernon’s [19mo] mom)

As I understand it, the down-regulation of the Beta receptors is a short lived problem once you quit using Beta agonists too much. For my money, inhaled steroids are the best way to go for long-term "controller"-type medicines for asthma.  The actual absorbed dose for most of them is miniscule, so the concern about so-called steroid side effects is really non-existent.  According to the data (sorry, no ready reference at hand), the amount of systemically absorbed steroids from one 5-day burst of prednisone is the same as that absorbed by taking twice-daily puffs of inhaled steroids for about 200 years.  Not a bad trade-off. Sorry to hear about your awful experience, but I’m glad to hear that the Advair is helping.  Anecdotally, I have a good friend who swears his life was saved by Advair…long story, but he had a similar experience and is now VERY happy that three years of Advair has produced zero asthma attacks. Mark, MD

Response:

Anti-Asthma Medications: Too Much of a Good Thing? Monday, August 18, 2003 Source – Journal of Clinical Investigation In an unusual paradox, asthmatics that are chronically treated with bronchodilating beta-agonist medications such as albuterol, ventolin, and salbutamol may ultimately develop increased sensitivity to airway constriction and experience exacerbation of their condition. A new study by Stephen Liggett and colleagues at the University of Cincinnati in the August 15, 2003, issue of the Journal of Clinical Investigation describes a responsible mechanism for this adverse reaction and reveals a potential new therapeutic target in the treatment of asthma. Inhaled selective beta -agonists are the most widely used treatment for the acute relief of asthma symptoms. Administered to asthmatic patients via an inhaler, nebulizer, in tablet or liquid form, or injection, they cause airway relaxation and reduced airway responsiveness to nonspecific contractile stimuli. This is achieved by drug binding to the beta2-adrenergic receptor (beta2AR). Despite the ability of these agents to immediately reverse airway obstruction, there has been ongoing concern that the use of these drugs may be associated with harmful outcomes. Some, but not all, studies have revealed that regular scheduled use (e.g., multiple times daily, every day) of inhaled beta-agonists has resulted in a loss of control over the condition, which can manifest as longer asthmatic attacks and post-treatment airway hyperresponsiveness. To date, the evidence has suggested that a desensitization of the beta2AR is responsible. . . .  [...] This is only an excerpt — read the complete news at: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=1433&ncid=1422&e=7&u=… Jai Maharaj http://www.mantra.com/jai Om Shanti Panchaang for 22 Shravan 5104, Tuesday, August 19, 2003: Shubhanu Nama Samvatsare Dakshinaya Jivana Ritau      Singh Mase Krishna Pakshe Mangal Vasara Yuktayam Krittik Nakshatr Dhruv Yog      Balav-Kaulav Karan Ashtami Yam Tithau Hindu Holocaust Museum http://www.mantra.com/holocaust Hindu life, principles, spirituality and philosophy http://www.hindu.org http://www.hindunet.org The truth about Islam and Muslims http://www.flex.com/~jai/satyamevajayate      o  Not for commercial use. Solely to be fairly used for the educational purposes of research and open discussion. The contents of this post may not have been authored by, and do not necessarily represent the opinion of the poster. The contents are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.      o  If you send private e-mail to me, it will likely not be read, considered or answered if it does not contain your full legal name, current e-mail and postal addresses, and live-voice telephone number.      o  Posted for information and discussion. Views expressed by others are not necessarily those of the poster.

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Question:

Jesus was a vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman

Doh!

Response:

One of the classic presenting neurological problems associated with iron excess .. is manic depression. Mania .. as evidenced in the articles below is linked closely to a lack of dopamine in the brain. Dopamine is destroyed by iron. Iron ‘rusts’ / oxidizes .. destroying antioxidants .. evidenced in MANY medical studies .. also evidenced by researchers who in order to induce a tocopherol / vitamin E deficiency in a lab animal simply overload it with iron. Phytic acid / IP6 .. a natural iron chelator / binder is being used as we speak to treat panic / anxiety disorder which has been shown to be linked to mania .. Phytic acid / IP6 can be found in any health food store.    Therefore lack of D2 receptors causes    individuals to have a high risk for multiple addictive, impulsive and    compulsive behavioral propensities, such as severe alcoholism,    cocaine, heroin, marijuana and nicotine use, glucose bingeing,    pathological gambling, sex addiction, ADHD, Tourette’s Syndrome,    autism, chronic violence, posttraumatic stress disorder,    schizoid/avoidant cluster, conduct disorder and antisocial behavior.    J Psychoactive Drugs 2000 Nov;32 Suppl:i-iv, 1-112 Reward deficiency syndrome: a biogenetic model for the diagnosis and treatment of impulsive, addictive, and compulsive behaviors.     Blum K, Braverman ER, Holder JM, Lubar JF, Monastra VJ, Miller D, Lubar JO,     Chen TJ, Comings DE    Department of Biological Sciences, University of North Texas, Denton,    Texas, USA.    The dopaminergic system, and in particular the dopamine D2 receptor,    has been implicated in reward mechanisms. The net effect of    neurotransmitter interaction at the mesolimbic brain region induces    "reward" when dopamine (DA) is released from the neuron at the nucleus    accumbens and interacts with a dopamine D2 receptor. "The reward    cascade" involves the release of serotonin, which in turn at the    hypothalmus stimulates enkephalin, which in turn inhibits GABA at the    substania nigra, which in turn fine tunes the amount of DA released at    the nucleus accumbens or "reward site." It is well known that under    normal conditions in the reward site DA works to maintain our normal    drives. In fact, DA has become to be known as the "pleasure molecule"    and/or the "antistress molecule." When DA is released into the    synapse, it stimulates a number a DA receptors (D1-D5) which results    in increased feelings of well-being and stress reduction. A consensus    of the literature suggests that when there is a dysfunction in the    brain reward cascade, which could be caused by certain genetic    variants (polygenic), especially in the DA system causing a    hypodopaminergic trait, the brain of that person requires a DA fix to    feel good. This trait leads to multiple drug-seeking behavior. This is    so because alcohol, cocaine, heroin, marijuana, nicotine, and glucose    all cause activation and neuronal release of brain DA, which could    heal the abnormal cravings. Certainly after ten years of study we    could say with confidence that carriers of the DAD2 receptor A1 allele    have compromised D2 receptors.    Therefore lack of D2 receptors causes    individuals to have a high risk for multiple addictive, impulsive and    compulsive behavioral propensities, such as severe alcoholism,    cocaine, heroin, marijuana and nicotine use, glucose bingeing,    pathological gambling, sex addiction, ADHD, Tourette’s Syndrome,    autism, chronic violence, posttraumatic stress disorder,    schizoid/avoidant cluster, conduct disorder and antisocial behavior.    In order to explain the breakdown of the reward cascade due to both    multiple genes and environmental stimuli (pleiotropism) and resultant    aberrant behaviors, Blum united this hypodopaminergic trait under the    rubric of a reward deficiency syndrome.    Publication Types:      * Review      * Review, academic    PMID: 11280926, UI: 21177392    Save the above report in [Macintosh] [Text] format    Order documents on this page through Loansome Doc Since Dr. Shute claimed vitamin E / tocopherol supplementation was all BUT if not a CURE for diabetes .. this article proves to be interesting ..    Neuroscience 2000;101(4):1029-36 Decreased messenger RNA expression of key markers of the nigrostriatal dopaminergic system following vitamin E deficiency in the rat.     Romero-Ramos M, Venero JL, Santiago M, Rodriguez-Gomez JA, Vizuete ML, Cano     J, Machado A    Departamento de Bioquimica, Bromatologia, Toxicologia y Medicina    Legal, Facultad de Farmacia, Universidad de Sevilla, Calle Profesor    Garcia Gonzalez s/n, 41012, Sevilla, Spain.    We have evaluated the effect of a vitamin E-deficient diet on the rat    nigrostriatal dopaminergic system. After 15 days of deficient diet,    the amount and activity of striatal and nigral tyrosine hydroxylase    increased, which contrasted with a decreased messenger RNA expression    for tyrosine hydroxylase and the dopamine transporter in the ventral    mesencephalon. When we prolonged the deficiency of vitamin E for 30    days, dopamine levels did not differ in both areas. In contrast,    messenger RNA levels for tyrosine hydroxylase and the dopamine    transporter were markedly reduced in 30-day deficient rats. In    addition, the number of oxidatively modified proteins significantly    increased in the striatal and nigral areas studied. Overall, we    propose that these changes suggest an important role of vitamin E in    maintaining the normal equilibrium of the dopaminergic nigrostriatal    system.    PMID: 11113352, UI: 20565894    Save the above report in [Macintosh] [Text] format    Order documents on this page through Loansome Doc Who loves ya. Tom Jesus was a vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If the Google search is so easy why do you never post the results? AND what do antibiotics have to do with a cold? Colds are caused by viruses. Antibiotics don’t do anything for viral infections. Don’t get me going on the drug-resistant bacteria subject!! Debs is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? As I said .. antibiotics are being considered as the NEWEST treatment and this is due to infection in the lung caused by a ‘bug’ which is/hasn’t been erradicated. A simple search in Google .. will bring up the studies .. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html My point exactly…..colds are caused by viruses….antibiotics only work on bacteria…. So regardless "antibiotics being used…..etc"…the quip about colds,,etc… One has NOTHING to do with the other!!!  Take all the antibiotics you please…won’t do a thing for cold viruses…again…colds/asthma??? what’s the point here bob

Virus’ .. use iron .. antibiotics .. bacteria .. use iron .. antibiotics .. Understand NOW? Same .. root .. iron .. So if a ‘treatment’ on a ‘disease’ .. seems to be WORKING .. IE: reduced attacks .. then a treatment for another disease WHICH USES THE SAME TREATMENT .. IE: same antibiotics.. same steroids .. WOULD be ‘indicated’ .. to ALSO work in THAT disease.   And using the ‘mindset’ of a pharmaceutical company .. the NEW ‘drug/treatment’ .. would/should be TESTED in that disease IN ORDER TO EXPAND THE CLIENT BASE .. and ‘reap the rewards’ .. cashola .. NOT doing so would amount to ‘bad business management’. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If the Google search is so easy why do you never post the results? AND what do antibiotics have to do with a cold? Colds are caused by viruses. Antibiotics don’t do anything for viral infections. Don’t get me going on the drug-resistant bacteria subject!! Debs is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? As I said .. antibiotics are being considered as the NEWEST treatment and this is due to infection in the lung caused by a ‘bug’ which is/hasn’t been erradicated. A simple search in Google .. will bring up the studies .. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

My point exactly…..colds are caused by viruses….antibiotics only work on bacteria…. So regardless "antibiotics being used…..etc"…the quip about colds,,etc… One has NOTHING to do with the other!!!  Take all the antibiotics you please…won’t do a thing for cold viruses…again…colds/asthma??? what’s the point here bob

Response:

lmao!!!

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Iron of course!!!  Just joking, couldn’t help myself.  UM MOM Susan is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? Bob

Response:

If the Google search is so easy why do you never post the results? AND what do antibiotics have to do with a cold? Colds are caused by viruses. Antibiotics don’t do anything for viral infections. Don’t get me going on the drug-resistant bacteria subject!! Debs – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? As I said .. antibiotics are being considered as the NEWEST treatment and this is due to infection in the lung caused by a ‘bug’ which is/hasn’t been erradicated. A simple search in Google .. will bring up the studies .. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

Response:

Not a damn thing. That’s why he posted it!! Debs – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? Bob

Response:

Oh yeah. I got that one wrong  ;) he he he he he Debs – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Iron of course!!!  Just joking, couldn’t help myself.  UM MOM Susan is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? Bob

Response:

is treated with antibiotics , Tom

OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? Bob

Response:

Iron of course!!!  Just joking, couldn’t help myself.  UM MOM Susan

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway??? Bob

Response:

is treated with antibiotics , Tom OK  I give up What does "catching a cold" have to do with ASTHMA anyway???

As I said .. antibiotics are being considered as the NEWEST treatment and this is due to infection in the lung caused by a ‘bug’ which is/hasn’t been erradicated. A simple search in Google .. will bring up the studies .. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This abstract deals with asthma….not colitis..I don’t see the word antibiotic anywhere  nor anti inflammatories….what’s  your point? I thought I was pretty plain in my post .. This is used in asthma .. BUT .. asthma is treated with antibiotics , steroids and antiinflammatories.. and so are the diseases on this list ..? So IF this WERE a ‘drug’ .. this treatment WOULD be being used in the diseases on this list .. Logic? Who loves ya. Tom Drugs are not necessarily interchangeable amongts conditions,,,just tract is not the same as doing same in the lungs,,nor doing same in a joint…The mechanisms of inflammation are different,,,thus the treatment is different…NO one size fits all…..

The inflammation in the lungs are treated with Pred .. in asthma .. the inflammation on this list is treated with Pred .. Asthma is NOT infectious,,therefore antibiotics are not routine…only if a secondary infection (like pneumonia) is present……

This seems to be a matter of contention .. according to the latest research .. and everyone knows .. you CAN ‘catch a cold’ from someone coughing in your face .. Generalizing can be dangerous..

Yes it can .. BUT when presented with the proper FACTS and studies which show .. at least in this case .. the drugs used are the SAME .. and are used to ‘treat’ the same conditions .. inflammatory ..   Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

Response:

You are confusing the definitions of inflammation……anti inflammatory  meds  such as   Motrin,,Anaprox etc are used for soft tissue inflammation,,such as in arthritis,,,sprains,,etc….the inflammation within the lungs in COPD,,asthma,,etc is not the same thing….STEROIDS such as prednisone are appropriate here,,,but not the "anti inflammatory" meds…

So I am ‘missing something’ here? I say that Asthma .. treatment by bloodletting .. is effective in lowering the attack rate and lowering the use of steroids? Your argument is? Prednisone is a steroid used in asthma .. therefore reduced. Since prednisone IS a steroid .. it IS .. an antiinflammatory. I argue since predinisone is used on this list .. the ‘indication’ would be .. the same treatment used in asthma .. bloodletting .. could then be extrapolated to this list .. using the ‘mindset’ of a drug company. As stated,,,,antibiotics are indicated if infection is present,,not on general principles….

As I said .. antibiotics are relatively NEW .. it will be the NEXT ‘treatment’ .. to come down the pike .. a simple search in Google will bring it up .. Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – This abstract deals with asthma….not colitis..I don’t see the word antibiotic anywhere  nor anti inflammatories….what’s  your point? I thought I was pretty plain in my post .. This is used in asthma .. BUT .. asthma is treated with antibiotics , steroids and antiinflammatories.. and so are the diseases on this list ..? So IF this WERE a ‘drug’ .. this treatment WOULD be being used in the diseases on this list .. Logic? Who loves ya. Tom

Drugs are not necessarily interchangeable amongts conditions,,,just tract is not the same as doing same in the lungs,,nor doing same in a joint…The mechanisms of inflammation are different,,,thus the treatment is different…NO one size fits all….. Asthma is NOT infectious,,therefore antibiotics are not routine…only if a secondary infection (like pneumonia) is present…… Generalizing can be dangerous.. bob

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – cd class of o1 This abstract deals with asthma….not colitis..I don’t see the  word antibiotic anywhere  nor anti inflammatories….what’s  your point? I thought I was pretty plain in my post ..  ..? So IF this WERE a ‘drug’ .. this treatment WOULD be being used in the diseases on this list .. Logic? Who loves ya. Tom — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html — Jesus was a Vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman Moses was a Mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html

You are confusing the definitions of inflammation……anti inflammatory  meds  such as   Motrin,,Anaprox etc are used for soft tissue inflammation,,such as in arthritis,,,sprains,,etc….the inflammation within the lungs in COPD,,asthma,,etc is not the same thing….STEROIDS such as prednisone are appropriate here,,,but not the "anti inflammatory" meds… As stated,,,,antibiotics are indicated if infection is present,,not on general principles…. I see no common usuage from what you "copied." Bob

Response:

I beg to differ with you COPD is damaged lungs.  The asthma does not have to be treated with steroids with the new inhalers that are out now. Antibiotics are used only if you get a bacterial infection.  I have been dealing with this since 1991, UM MOM Susan

This is from the Jewish Hospital site the #1 site for lung disease in the States.                       Inhaled and Oral Corticosteroids     Corticosteroids (steroids) are medicines that are used to treat many         chronic diseases. Corticosteroids are very good at reducing      inflammation (swelling) and mucus production in the airways of the       lungs. They also help other quick-relief medicines work better.    The steroids (corticosteroids) used to treat asthma and other chronic    lung diseases are not the same as anabolic steroids, used illegally by      some athletes for bodybuilding. Corticosteroids do not affect the                          liver or cause sterility.                         Does the Body Make Steroids?      Corticosteroids are similar to cortisol, a hormone produced by the    adrenal glands in the body. Cortisol is one of the body’s own natural       steroids. Cortisol is essential for life and well being. During      stress, our bodies produce extra cortisol to keep us from becoming                                  very sick.      Normally the adrenal glands release cortisol into the blood stream       every morning. The brain monitors this amount and regulates the       adrenal function. It cannot tell the difference between its own      natural cortisone and that of steroid medicines. Therefore, when a     person takes high doses of steroids over a long time, the brain may         decrease or stop cortisol production. This is called adrenal    supression. Health care providers generally decrease a steroid dosage    slowly to allow the adrenal gland to recover and produce cortisol at a    normal level again. If you have been on steroids long-term do not stop           taking them suddenly. Follow your doctor’s prescription.                       What are Some Steroid Medicines?    Steroid medicines are available as nasal sprays, metered-dose-inhalers         (inhaled steroids), oral forms (pills or syrups), shots and     intravenous (IV) solutions. Health care providers at National Jewish    rarely use steroid shots for the treatment of chronic lung disorders.      With severe episodes or emergencies, high-dose steroids are often    given in an IV. As the symptoms improve, the medicine is changed from                 IV to oral forms and then slowly decreased.    Inhaled steroids and steroid pills and syrups are often prescribed for                     people with a chronic lung disease.                               Inhaled Steroids                       Common inhaled steroids include:                           Pulmicort

Question:

      Last week I went from the pulmonary therapy studio to the ER because of high pulse rate. Atrial fibrillation showed on the EKG. Sounds scary. But not to worry said my regular doctor (who is a long experienced ER practitioner)  Sure enough a drug brought down the pulse and restored the normal sinus picture on the EKG.  And damn soon at that.          The underlying reason?  Pushing.  Being pushed to preform better,  in this case, on the treadmill.             My advice is to get away from goal oriented directors.   Y o u r   goal after all is to get better,  not to run faster or lift more.              I’m new to this physical therapy game but have seen some real improvement in my condition and in a very short time.  I’m most surely willing, from this point on,  to go slowly and gently and watch the improvement unfold as it may on its own terms. —jack

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok, I have a kind of complicated question that I haven’t really seen anyone talk about.  I’m a rower with mild exercise induced asthma.  I take Claritin for allergies as needed and Flovent 2 puffs twice a day. I have to use an albuterol inhalor for hard workouts, but usually don’t use it for easy steady state workouts because it makes me jittery (I work out in the evenings). Until recently, I did my steady state workouts on the rowing ergometer at a pace that felt easy – I could comfortably talk in full sentences, a pace my former coach described as "you could recite the Gettysburg Address if you went to a better Junior High than I did."  I now have a new coach who had us do Conconi tests (progressively increasing power output every two minutes until failure; graph HR v Watts to find deflection point. Deflection point = Anaerobic Threshhold) to determine target heart rate ranges for steady state workouts.  Our target heart rate ranges top out just below AT.  The test was obviously nasty, and I used my inhalor beforehand. Given that the inhalor increases my heart rate, is the target heart rate determined by the test too high?  Although the new range is higher than I was doing my easy steady state at before, I would guess it’s probably not too high because I can still talk (short sentences) when I’m in the range when I use the inhalor. I need to pull harder to hit the range when I do not use my inhalor, and it seems more difficult (which makes sense given that I’m pulling harder). Should I use the inhalor for steady state workouts? Ok, I guess this is more of a ramble than an actual question, since it’s largely becoming a moot point as our coach is adding a few 5 – 7 minute sprints at higher ratings in the middle of the steady state pieces, so I have to use the inhalor anyway. Actually, I do have a semi-related question regarding inhaled steroids.  I read that they contribute to an increased risk of osteoporosis with continued use.  Would taking breaks from the flovent during the offseason when I’m not working out hard be a good way to reduce that risk? I don’t have asthma symptoms when I don’t work out hard – I wasn’t diagnosed with asthma until I started rowing in college. Thanks for listening, Melissa

Right, I’ve also been away over Christmas, but this is a familiar subject.  I’ve been rowing for seven years now and have asthma that is not just exercise induced, but rowing tends to be the main cause of my hospital trips!  My doctor and I have worked up and up to try and reduce the hospital trips and have come up with the following medication: 8 puffs Becloforte 250, 2 puffs Serevent, 2 capsules Slophyllin per day with Salbutamol as required (or albuterol to you).  With that regime I use the salbtamol before rowing and am usually fine.  I think you should always use the inhaler before steady state pieces to be on the safe side, no matter how nice the nurses are, a trip to hospital is never pleasant.  My heartrate doesn’t seem to differ at higher levels with and without inhalers (as discovered on the odd occasions I’ve forgotten the wretched thing), but the pain in my chest is increased (what a surprise!)  If osteoperosis is cause by taking steroids, I guess I’ll be crumbling sometime soon, but I’ll trust Robert on what he said about it being the tablets that cause the problem.  Anyway I take calcium tablets, so maybe that would help alieve your worries. KT

Response:

Current guidelines are for asthmatics to have an Action Plan to adjust their drugs, based on symptoms and peak flow readings. The goal is to stay well within the Green Zone [80-100% personal best] on the peak flow meter with minimal symptoms. You might consider lowering the strength or/and dose of Flovent in off season. Also adding Serevent, a long acting bronchodilator, might reduce the need for Flovent.

I started rowing just over a year ago and have had asthma for over 10 years.  My medication always consisted of an inhaled steroid and a reliever.  Once I started rowing I found that this wasn’t sufficient to control my asthma, particularly when working hard over long durations (e.g. head races).  In October this year I was prescribed Salmeterol (Serevent) in addition to the steroid and reliever.  I have seen an increase in peak flow by over 12 per cent since starting with the medication and I find I can perform far better over the longer pieces. Richard

Response:

I haven’t done any extensive testing of HR against workload, but for what it’s worth the albuterol (salbutamol over here in the UK) taken before exercise lifts my resting HR by nearly 10bpm, but doesn’t seem to affect the HR at which I hit anaerobic threshold, compared with doing the same task without pre-exercise medication (we’re talking bicycle time trials, in case you’re interested). I’m guessing that the elevated HR from the meds quickly becomes insignificant compared with the elevation of HR caused by the task, given that any significant exercise task will raise HR to about twice the resting HR. Might make an interesting study for a physiology/pharmacology student, though.

snip Given that the inhalor increases my heart rate, is the target heart rate determined by the test too high?  Although the new range is higher than I was doing my easy steady state at before, I would guess it’s probably not too high because I can still talk (short sentences) when I’m in the range when I use the inhalor. I need to pull harder to

snip

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Ok, I have a kind of complicated question that I haven’t really seen anyone talk about.  I’m a rower with mild exercise induced asthma.  I take Claritin for allergies as needed and Flovent 2 puffs twice a day. I have to use an albuterol inhalor for hard workouts, but usually don’t use it for easy steady state workouts because it makes me jittery (I work out in the evenings). Until recently, I did my steady state workouts on the rowing ergometer at a pace that felt easy – I could comfortably talk in full sentences, a pace my former coach described as "you could recite the Gettysburg Address if you went to a better Junior High than I did."  I now have a new coach who had us do Conconi tests (progressively increasing power output every two minutes until failure; graph HR v Watts to find deflection point. Deflection point = Anaerobic Threshhold) to determine target heart rate ranges for steady state workouts.  Our target heart rate ranges top out just below AT.  The test was obviously nasty, and I used my inhalor beforehand. Given that the inhalor increases my heart rate, is the target heart rate determined by the test too high?

The test determines your maximum heart rate, which is not affected by the albuterol, but by your physiology. Then a target rate would be calculated by taking a per cent of max, like 80%. The albuterol could raise your heart rate at lower levels of exertion below the max. You might reach your target rate sooner, if using a lot of albuterol, and your physical output might be lower under this condition.   Although the new range is higher than I was doing my easy steady state at before, I would guess it’s probably not too high because I can still talk (short sentences) when I’m in the range when I use the inhalor. I need to pull harder to hit the range when I do not use my inhalor, and it seems more difficult (which makes sense given that I’m pulling harder). Should I use the inhalor for steady state workouts?

use if needed.  Ok, I guess this is more of a ramble than an actual question, since it’s largely becoming a moot point as our coach is adding a few 5 – 7 minute sprints at higher ratings in the middle of the steady state pieces, so I have to use the inhalor anyway. Actually, I do have a semi-related question regarding inhaled steroids.  I read that they contribute to an increased risk of osteoporosis with continued use.  Would taking breaks from the flovent during the offseason when I’m not working out hard be a good way to reduce that risk? I don’t have asthma symptoms when I don’t work out hard – I wasn’t diagnosed with asthma until I started rowing in college. Thanks for listening, Melissa

The osteoporosis side effect of steroids is dose dependent. Flovent comes in 3 strengths–44, 110, 220 ug fluticasone per puff. Current guidelines are for asthmatics to have an Action Plan to adjust their drugs, based on symptoms and peak flow readings. The goal is to stay well within the Green Zone [80-100% personal best] on the peak flow meter with minimal symptoms. You might consider lowering the strength or/and dose of Flovent in off season. Also adding Serevent, a long acting bronchodilator, might reduce the need for Flovent. Links: http://www.NationalJewish.org/medfacts/asthma_action_plan.html USING AN ACTION PLAN TO MANAGE YOUR ASTHMA http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/new/press/01-09-26.htm NHLBI Supported Study Finds Inhaled Steroids Accelerate Bone Loss  in Women with Asthma Treatment Still Recommended for Persistent Asthma Excerpt: ""The effect of inhaled steroid use on bone density was shown to be dose related," notes Lenfant. "We encourage all patients with asthma to work with their doctors on a comprehensive treatment plan; that is, the lowest possible dose of inhaled steroids that controls their asthma symptoms as well as measures to maintain good bone health, such as adequate calcium and vitamin D intake." One option to lower steroid dosage is to supplement therapy with long-acting beta-agonists. Two studies by the NHLBI Asthma Clinical Research Network recently found that adult men and women with mild-to-moderate persistent asthma who used both medications were able to reduce steroid dosage, on average, by 50 percent without losing symptom control. Those treated with long-acting beta-agonists alone, however, suffered from significantly worse symptoms compared to those treated with inhaled steroids alone or with both medications. These findings were reported in the May 23, 2001, issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association. " Ellis

Response:

Ok, I have a kind of complicated question that I haven’t really seen anyone talk about.  I’m a rower with mild exercise induced asthma.  I take Claritin for allergies as needed and Flovent 2 puffs twice a day. I have to use an albuterol inhalor for hard workouts, but usually don’t use it for easy steady state workouts because it makes me jittery (I work out in the evenings). Until recently, I did my steady state workouts on the rowing ergometer at a pace that felt easy – I could comfortably talk in full sentences, a pace my former coach described as "you could recite the Gettysburg Address if you went to a better Junior High than I did."  I now have a new coach who had us do Conconi tests (progressively increasing power output every two minutes until failure; graph HR v Watts to find deflection point. Deflection point = Anaerobic Threshhold) to determine target heart rate ranges for steady state workouts.  Our target heart rate ranges top out just below AT.  The test was obviously nasty, and I used my inhalor beforehand. Given that the inhalor increases my heart rate, is the target heart rate determined by the test too high?  Although the new range is higher than I was doing my easy steady state at before, I would guess it’s probably not too high because I can still talk (short sentences) when I’m in the range when I use the inhalor. I need to pull harder to hit the range when I do not use my inhalor, and it seems more difficult (which makes sense given that I’m pulling harder). Should I use the inhalor for steady state workouts? Ok, I guess this is more of a ramble than an actual question, since it’s largely becoming a moot point as our coach is adding a few 5 – 7 minute sprints at higher ratings in the middle of the steady state pieces, so I have to use the inhalor anyway. Actually, I do have a semi-related question regarding inhaled steroids.  I read that they contribute to an increased risk of osteoporosis with continued use.  Would taking breaks from the flovent during the offseason when I’m not working out hard be a good way to reduce that risk? I don’t have asthma symptoms when I don’t work out hard – I wasn’t diagnosed with asthma until I started rowing in college. Thanks for listening, Melissa

Response:

Question:

Well I’ve lurked enough, Barry, Peter, and Diane need not reply cause I don’t buy what you sell anyway (I just delete your posts), thanks in advance. I’m 48 years old smoked for 32 years ( I started young) Quit smoking 4 years ago last super bowl Sunday. I’ve been asthmatic for 2 years. Currently I take Serevent 2puff BID, Flovent 220 4puff/Bid, Proventil as needed, Accolate 2 a day (Singulair did nothing for me), and Prednisone when I get bad. I’ve been on Serezone for the depression/mood swings I blame on the steroids (my Docs agree) for about 3 months. I took Effexor and Ambien before the Serezone. That particular cocktail cost me about 3 months of my life that I can’t even remember. I am top of the list at my pulmonary specialist’s hospital for the Anti-iGe therapy as soon as it is available with a hope I can get off the steroids. Now you know my med history I do have a question or two. I really respect my pulmonary Doc. He is Asthmatic as well and really seems to care but when I ask about allergy testing he draws a line and says it is a waste of time for someone my age. My family Doc agrees but you guys always seem to refer to it. Should I be more aggressive in pursuing this or drop it? I feel it is too hard to just keep guessing at what might be a problem. I’m a Master Gardener with University of Florida (e-mail your garden questions) and I know there are some pollen issues but I can only guess what to avoid.( my paint respirator is a fashion statement I could do without. We have cats but we got them after I got sick and they make it neither worse or better. ( the companionship is great though).     One more question not on topic please forgive but I don’t know who else to ask. Now my family Doc is on a major cholesterol kick (mine is 201 total and 299 Trigliserides which he feels is too high) He put me on Niaspan, the rash and flush was unbearable so we had to stop that then he gave me a script for Tricor which I have not filled. There is no family history of heart disease and the average age at death on both sides of my family is 90 back almost 300 years. I’m not too worried but he is. I also feel the Tricor has too many possible severe sideeffects to warrant the risk and too strong for my needs anyway. CBI, Scooby and you guys a little advise here please. Thanks to all you all have help me through the tough times even if you didn’t know it keep posting and ignore the nuts. Sorry for the long post. God bless all, even Peter and Barry and Diane Norm

Response:

I’m 48 years old smoked for 32 years ( I started young) Quit smoking 4 years ago last super bowl Sunday. I’ve been asthmatic for 2 years. Currently I take Serevent 2puff BID, Flovent 220 4puff/Bid, Proventil as needed, Accolate 2 a day (Singulair did nothing for me), and Prednisone when I get bad. I’ve been on Serezone for the depression/mood swings I blame on the steroids (my Docs agree) for about 3 months. I took Effexor and Ambien before the Serezone. That particular cocktail cost me about 3 months of my life that I can’t even remember. I am top of the list at my pulmonary specialist’s hospital for the Anti-iGe therapy as soon as it is available with a hope I can get off the steroids. Now you know my med history I do have a question or two. I really respect my pulmonary Doc. He is Asthmatic as well and really seems to care but when I ask about allergy testing he draws a line and says it is a waste of time for someone my age. My family Doc agrees but you guys always seem to refer to it.

Asthma can be allergic or nonallergic. Those with allergies generally have a history of allergies going back to childhood [hives, eczema, hayfever, itchy eyes] and relatives with allergies. For adults without a history of allergies, testing is generally not very useful. Especially with your history of smoking, which could indicate a COPD [emphysema] component. More likely nonallergic triggers like smog, smoke, chemical fumes, viruses, cold or dry air, would be your primary asthma triggers. Due to your history of smoking, you might benefit from adding Atrovent [or Combivent] to your inhalers. Should I be more – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – aggressive in pursuing this or drop it? I feel it is too hard to just keep guessing at what might be a problem. I’m a Master Gardener with University of Florida (e-mail your garden questions) and I know there are some pollen issues but I can only guess what to avoid.( my paint respirator is a fashion statement I could do without. We have cats but we got them after I got sick and they make it neither worse or better. ( the companionship is great though).     One more question not on topic please forgive but I don’t know who else to ask. Now my family Doc is on a major cholesterol kick (mine is 201 total and 299 Trigliserides which he feels is too high) He put me on Niaspan, the rash and flush was unbearable so we had to stop that then he gave me a script for Tricor which I have not filled. There is no family history of heart disease and the average age at death on both sides of my family is 90 back almost 300 years. I’m not too worried but he is. I also feel the Tricor has too many possible severe sideeffects to warrant the risk and too strong for my needs anyway. Norm

Regarding cholesterol, I would suggest the NG sci.med.cardiology However; your total cholesterol is not that high. What are your LDL [bad] and HDL [good] cholesterol levels? The somewhat high triglyceride level should first be treated with diet [reduced simple carbohydrates] and exercise. It could indicate a prediabetic condition. For those with low HDL and high LDL, niacin can be a good drug to use. I take 500 mg/day of fast release niacin to improve cholesteral ratio [total/HDL] under a doctor’s guidance. This is considered a low dose for this purpose; many can’t stand a high dose, myself included, due to side effects. However HDL was raised 30% and LDL lowered 9%. Niaspan is a new prescription form slow-release niacin, taken in the evening. The slow release niacin is more effective at lowering LDL than quick release, but is harder on liver. Niacin has to be started at a low dose and gradually increased, to avoid flushing. Links: http://www.americanheart.org/ American Heart Assoc. http://www.americanheart.org/cholesterol/ Ellis — Free audio & video emails, greeting cards and forums Talkway – http://www.talkway.com – Talk more ways (sm)

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well I’ve lurked enough, Barry, Peter, and Diane need not reply cause I don’t buy what you sell anyway (I just delete your posts), thanks in advance. I’m 48 years old smoked for 32 years ( I started young) Quit smoking 4 years ago last super bowl Sunday. I’ve been asthmatic for 2 years. Currently I take Serevent 2puff BID, Flovent 220 4puff/Bid, Proventil as needed, Accolate 2 a day (Singulair did nothing for me), and Prednisone when I get bad. I’ve been on Serezone for the depression/mood swings I blame on the steroids (my Docs agree) for about 3 months. I took Effexor and Ambien before the Serezone. That particular cocktail cost me about 3 months of my life that I can’t even remember. I am top of the list at my pulmonary specialist’s hospital for the Anti-iGe therapy as soon as it is available with a hope I can get off the steroids. Now you know my med history I do have a question or two. I really respect my pulmonary Doc. He is Asthmatic as well and really seems to care but when I ask about allergy testing he draws a line and says it is a waste of time for someone my age. My family Doc agrees but you guys always seem to refer to it. Should I be more aggressive in pursuing this or drop it? I feel it is too hard to just keep guessing at what might be a problem. I’m a Master Gardener with University of Florida (e-mail your garden questions) and I know there are some pollen issues but I can only guess what to avoid.( my paint respirator is a fashion statement I could do without. We have cats but we got them after I got sick and they make it neither worse or better. ( the companionship is great though).

I would tend to agree with Ellis. Is there an allergy/asthma history or family history that you haven’t mentioned? From what you have told us it would appear that your problem is more the smoking related COPD variety than allergy/asthma. If this is the case the Accolate would not be expected to help, the inhaled steroids may or may not help, and allergy shots would not be beneficial. As far as the Accolate and inhaled steroids go, if they help you stay off of oral steroids then they should be taken but otherwise you may want to really pay attention and try to determine how much good they are doing. If it is COPD then Ellis is right that Atrovent or Combivent might help you (might even if it is asthma). In general, I am not a big fan of allergy shots. They are somewhat effective, if all the allergens are identified, at a great effort and expense. I find that conventional allergy meds usually will do a better job with lower cost and less bother to the patient. I do consider them if I have a person who’s allergies or especially asthma are hard to control. I usually send people with allergies who are frequently or chronically on oral steroids or high doses of inhaled steroids to the allergist. If the doctor suspects that allergies are part of the problem they may be worthwhile. He is treating you as if you were an allergy related asthmatic more than a smoking related COPDer so this may be worth discussing. It may be there are some aspects that did not come across in your post. Your ocupation does add an interesting twist to the discussion. If it isn’t allergies then it isn’t allergies and the shots won’t help. If you get worse at work it would be more likely an allergy. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –     One more question not on topic please forgive but I don’t know who else to ask. Now my family Doc is on a major cholesterol kick (mine is 201 total and 299 Trigliserides which he feels is too high) He put me on Niaspan, the rash and flush was unbearable so we had to stop that then he gave me a script for Tricor which I have not filled. There is no family history of heart disease and the average age at death on both sides of my family is 90 back almost 300 years. I’m not too worried but he is. I also feel the Tricor has too many possible severe sideeffects to warrant the risk and too strong for my needs anyway. CBI, Scooby and you guys a little advise here please. Thanks to all you all have help me through the tough times even if you didn’t know it keep posting and ignore the nuts. Sorry for the long post. God bless all, even Peter and Barry and Diane Norm

You have two risks for heart disease (elevated lipids and smoking). When you turn 55 that will be three. If your HDL is low that may be four. You apparently don’t have diabetes or high blood pressure. If the HDL is 60 that counts as a "negative risk factor." I would agree that TG’s of 299 considered alone are too high. The best way to lower them is through diet and excersize. The steroids can also be raising this (another reason to try to get the dose down) and your thyroid should be checked if it hasn’t been. If optimizing these things doesn’t lower it then eliminating this risk factor through medicines is something to consider. If the LDL is very low and/or the HDL is very high your over-all lipid panel may not constitute a risk. The Tricor is usually well tolerated with rare liver toxicity (should be checked every few months). You may find that taking the pills is not as bad as it seems at first blush (no pun intended – but not edited out after I caught it either). You may want to try taking an aspirin (unless it sets off the breathing) before taking the Niacin or getting some immediate release Niacin and starting at lower doses. Usually the flushing gets better with time. Good Luck — CBI, M.D. Please note: It is impossible to accurately diagnose medical problems without seeing the patient and reviewing the entire history. These posts are intended to be helpful and informative. Always check with your doctor before following any advice given.

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Well I’ve lurked enough, Barry, Peter, and Diane need not reply cause I don’t buy what you sell anyway (I just delete your posts), thanks in advance. I’m 48 years old smoked for 32 years ( I started young) Quit smoking 4 years ago last super bowl Sunday. I’ve been asthmatic for 2 years. Currently I take Serevent 2puff BID, Flovent 220 4puff/Bid, Proventil as needed, Accolate 2 a day (Singulair did nothing for me), and Prednisone when I get bad. I’ve been on Serezone for the depression/mood swings I blame on the steroids (my Docs agree) for about 3 months. I took Effexor and Ambien before the Serezone. That particular cocktail cost me about 3 months of my life that I can’t even remember. I am top of the list at my pulmonary specialist’s hospital for the Anti-iGe therapy as soon as it is available with a hope I can get off the steroids. Now you know my med history I do have a question or two. I really respect my pulmonary Doc. He is Asthmatic as well and really seems to care but when I ask about allergy testing he draws a line and says it is a waste of time for someone my age. My family Doc agrees but you guys always seem to refer to it. Should I be more aggressive in pursuing this or drop it?

IMO, allergy testing is fairly cheap and can provide clues that will help you better manage your asthma.  For example you can have a pollen allergy that you can handle by avoiding the plants in question. There is a major debate as to which is a better specialist for asthma. I tend to lean toward allergists because allergys typically play a huge role in asthma. I am somewhat surprised by your doctor’s reluctance to refer you to an allergist – considering the medications you are on I would expect him to have referred you just to see if something can be done that will allow you to reduce the meds. Another thing you can do is ask to be referred to a regional (or national) asthma treatment center for evaluation.   It’s a terrible responsibility – but somebody has to be the Americans.

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Asthma can be allergic or nonallergic. Those with allergies generally have a history of allergies going back to childhood [hives, eczema, hayfever, itchy eyes] and relatives with allergies. For adults without a history of allergies, testing is generally not very useful. Especially with your history of smoking, which could indicate a COPD [emphysema] component. More likely nonallergic triggers like smog, smoke, chemical fumes, viruses, cold or dry air, would be your primary asthma triggers.

My experience is not entirely consistent with these "general" statements.  I am an ex-smoker — quit as soon as I developed asthma. I have no family history of allergies, and I personally never had any kind of allergy symptoms until I developed asthma at age 35.  No skin problems, no hayfever, no itchy eyes, no allergies to food or medicine, nothing.  When I developed asthma, I went to an allergist and tested positive for dust mite and mold allergies.   For me, treating the allergies has played a major role in decreasing my asthma symptoms.  I take Claritin year-round.  Without it, I experienced severe runny nose and sneezing, woke up nightly with severe coughing episodes within an hour of going to bed, and had frequent coughing episodes during the day.  I believe the nighttime coughing was primarily due to postnasal drip.  These episodes were severe, and lasted several hours at a time.  The coughing episodes improved with Albuterol, but I frequently had to use Albuterol multiple times per day, several days per week. When I started taking Claritin, my symptoms improved dramatically. The runny nose and sneezing almost disappeared, and the number of coughing episodes decreased to a few per month.   Now that my allergies are under control, my remaining asthma triggers do include some of those mentioned above:  smoke and perfume top my list of things I wish the world could do without. Amazing how much asthma seems to differ from person to person. SJ

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Question:

As you take the vitamins, you should try to "DOSE DOWN" on your asthma medication.  

of course you just "forgot" to mention that ANNY changes in doseage of ANY medication should be done AFTER consultation with your physician…… Eventually, you shouldn’t be taking any prescription meds for your asthma – only the vitamins.

Your comment here is not only ridiculous, but made with reckless disregard for the health and well-being of others.  Currently there are NO studies which demonstrate any ability of vitamins to replace medical management of asthma……and this includes vitamins eliminating the need for medications to treat asthma. I suggest you go back where you came from and take your drivel with you. Scooby RCP, EMT-P Perinatal-Pediatric Respiratory Specialist This mail is a natural product.  The slight variations in spelling and grammar enhance its individual character and beauty and in no way are to be considered flaws or defects.

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The best thing to do with vitamins (and my doctor and several vitamin specialists told me this), is to take them in accordance with your current asthma medication.  As you take the vitamins, you should try to "DOSE DOWN" on your asthma medication.  Eventually, you shouldn’t be taking any prescription meds for your asthma – only the vitamins.  This is something I’m trying now. So far, so good.

If your doctor told you this you need to change doctors.  The use of vitamin supplements for the treatment of asthma has been tested – and found to be useless. BTW, exactly what is a ‘vitamin specalist?’  Is this a fancy term for ’salesman?’ You are risking your health.  You are getting scammed by people who are perfectly willing to risk your life in order to get at the contents of your wallet. No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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I’m not here for a flame war – I’m here to give some worthwhile adive.  Of course, certain treatments are going to affect different people in different ways.  I don’t have any reckless disregard because what I’m doing is giving advice, I’m not actually administering these remedies that I mention.  My situation is that I DID consult and doctor and she said to be careful about taking vitamins with certain medications.  But she also gave me the advice that if you choose to "DOSE DOWN" your medications, be careful and be sure to consult her if there are any problems. By the way, how the hell did you become a doctor?? LOF – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – As you take the vitamins, you should try to "DOSE DOWN" on your asthma medication. of course you just "forgot" to mention that ANNY changes in doseage of ANY medication should be done AFTER consultation with your physician…… Eventually, you shouldn’t be taking any prescription meds for your asthma – only the vitamins. Your comment here is not only ridiculous, but made with reckless disregard for the health and well-being of others.  Currently there are NO studies which demonstrate any ability of vitamins to replace medical management of asthma……and this includes vitamins eliminating the need for medications to treat asthma. I suggest you go back where you came from and take your drivel with you. Scooby RCP, EMT-P Perinatal-Pediatric Respiratory Specialist This mail is a natural product.  The slight variations in spelling and grammar enhance its individual character and beauty and in no way are to be considered flaws or defects.

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As an example, she showed me how she could INDUCE an asthmatic spasm by pressing on certain nerves of my back, and then immediately relieve it with pressure on another area.

I wonder if this would have worked with a sceptic? No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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I’m not here for a flame war – I’m here to give some worthwhile adive.  Of course, certain treatments are going to affect different people in different ways.  I don’t have any reckless disregard because what I’m doing is giving advice, I’m not actually administering these remedies that I mention.  My situation is that I DID consult and doctor and she said to be careful about taking vitamins with certain medications.  But she also gave me the advice that if you choose to "DOSE DOWN" your medications, be careful and be sure to consult her if there are any problems. By the way, how the hell did you become a doctor?? LOF

he got to be an RCP by doing a hell of a lot of training now, am I imagining this or are you really saying that you told your doctor you were taking vitamins and intending to cut down on your meds…and consequently she warned you of the risks of certain vitamins and of cutting down on your meds, suggesting you should see her instantly if you encountered problems seems like it isn’t a doctor supporting your choice to rely on vitamins…it is a doctor accepting that you are going to do it whatever the evidence and trying to make sure you don’t cause yourself too many problems eric "the alternative to seeing things in black and white is to see them in full colour"

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I refuse to use this forum as a flame war thank you!!

I did not insult you.  You got an honest answer. What type of answer did you want? No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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I refuse to use this forum as a flame war thank you!! LOF – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – The best thing to do with vitamins (and my doctor and several vitamin specialists told me this), is to take them in accordance with your current asthma medication.  As you take the vitamins, you should try to "DOSE DOWN" on your asthma medication.  Eventually, you shouldn’t be taking any prescription meds for your asthma – only the vitamins.  This is something I’m trying now. So far, so good. If your doctor told you this you need to change doctors.  The use of vitamin supplements for the treatment of asthma has been tested – and found to be useless. BTW, exactly what is a ‘vitamin specalist?’  Is this a fancy term for ’salesman?’ You are risking your health.  You are getting scammed by people who are perfectly willing to risk your life in order to get at the contents of your wallet. No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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As an example, she showed me how she could INDUCE an asthmatic spasm by pressing on certain nerves of my back, and then immediately relieve it with pressure on another area. I wonder if this would have worked with a sceptic?

I was a skeptic, albeit a desperate one. J. Smith

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My three year old son was diagnosed with asthma at three months old. He has been hospitilized four times for it.about six months ago,

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The best thing to do with vitamins (and my doctor and several vitamin specialists told me this), is to take them in accordance with your current asthma medication.  As you take the vitamins, you should try to "DOSE DOWN" on your asthma medication.  Eventually, you shouldn’t be taking any prescription meds for your asthma – only the vitamins.  This is something I’m trying now. So far, so good. LOF – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Its easy to dismiss success, I eat oysters once a week ( high source of calcium)and wear a crystal amulet ( anti-oxidant effect) around my neck and have been asthma free ever since.;-) I expect that the above is a joke. The problem is that the osteopath in the original message may be incompetent.  Calcium supplements are frequently recommended for people who are on long term oral steroids.  This is not for the asthma, but to reduce a side effect of the medication. If the doctor is not aware of this and thinks that the calcium is some sort of direct asthma treatment, then that doctor is incompetent. No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -The best treatment I ever had for my asthma, (which was unresponsive to any other treatment including six weeks on prednisone,) was acupuncture and spinal manipulation.   Call it voodoo, or placebo effect, or whatever you like, but the effect was virtually immediate and long-lasting.  My Chinese doctor was a very wise woman who understood the body like no one before her. As an example, she showed me how she could INDUCE an asthmatic spasm by pressing on certain nerves of my back, and then immediately relieve it with pressure on another area.

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About two weeks ago I remembered something an osteopath once said to me: calcium and vitamin C are both good for asthma.  I figured I had nothing to loose so why not try it.  I bought a bottle of calcium (already had the C). About a week after getting on the calcium I became symptom free and haven’t used my inhaler once.

My daughter takes 800mg of citrical+D due to milk allergy and her asthma is not improving as a result.

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Its easy to dismiss success, I eat oysters once a week ( high source of calcium)and wear a crystal amulet ( anti-oxidant effect) around my neck and have been asthma free ever since.;-)

I expect that the above is a joke. The problem is that the osteopath in the original message may be incompetent.  Calcium supplements are frequently recommended for people who are on long term oral steroids.  This is not for the asthma, but to reduce a side effect of the medication. If the doctor is not aware of this and thinks that the calcium is some sort of direct asthma treatment, then that doctor is incompetent. No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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About two weeks ago I remembered something an osteopath once said to me: calcium and vitamin C are both good for asthma.   . . . Perhaps calcium and vitamin C might benefit others.  If any readers have any luck, please let me know.

The best treatment I ever had for my asthma, (which was unresponsive to any other treatment including six weeks on prednisone,) was acupuncture and spinal manipulation.   Call it voodoo, or placebo effect, or whatever you like, but the effect was virtually immediate and long-lasting.  My Chinese doctor was a very wise woman who understood the body like no one before her. As an example, she showed me how she could INDUCE an asthmatic spasm by pressing on certain nerves of my back, and then immediately relieve it with pressure on another area.

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About two weeks ago I remembered something an osteopath once said to me: calcium and vitamin C are both good for asthma.  I figured I had nothing to loose so why not try it.  I bought a bottle of calcium (already had the C). About a week after getting on the calcium I became symptom free and haven’t used my inhaler once.  Not once.  I feel better than I have in years.

The most likely reason is that this is either coincidence or the placebo (or Hawthorne) effect. Both of these have been extensively studied and found to be useless for the treatment of asthma. Hopefully this osteopath has you on some form of asthma control medications.   If he has not you need to dump him and find a competent doctor.  Otherwise you are at risk for irreversible airways damage. No electrons were harmed in the posting of this message.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – About two weeks ago I remembered something an osteopath once said to me: calcium and vitamin C are both good for asthma.  I figured I had nothing to loose so why not try it.  I bought a bottle of calcium (already had the C). About a week after getting on the calcium I became symptom free and haven’t used my inhaler once.  Not once.  I feel better than I have in years. The most likely reason is that this is either coincidence or the placebo (or Hawthorne) effect. Both of these have been extensively studied and found to be useless for the treatment of asthma.

Its easy to dismiss success, I eat oysters once a week ( high source of calcium)and wear a crystal amulet ( anti-oxidant effect) around my neck and have been asthma free ever since.;-)

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Hello all.  I’m new to the group. Over the past two years or so my asthma has been pretty bad.  I started using Albuterol (SP?) about the time I started having trouble (again, about two years ago).  Since then I became more reliant on my inhaler, to the point that I was using it about seven times a day. About two weeks ago I remembered something an osteopath once said to me: calcium and vitamin C are both good for asthma.  I figured I had nothing to loose so why not try it.  I bought a bottle of calcium (already had the C). About a week after getting on the calcium I became symptom free and haven’t used my inhaler once.  Not once.  I feel better than I have in years. Perhaps calcium and vitamin C might benefit others.  If any readers have any luck, please let me know. Cheers, Rob Putnam Rob Putnam See my satire and news parody page at:         http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Alley/9610/

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Question:

Thanks for your answers to my sons problem. And then to Lisas Heartbeats. I think you should look up a heartspecialist, but truly I think your doctor is right. It

Question:

(Pam) writes: Serevent – bronchidilater inhaler, 2 puffs, 2 times a day (to which the nurse added, ONLY 2 times a day!  Anymore will kill you!)  

Oh dear – I’m on 2 puffs THREE times a day. Re’ the order of taking medication I was advised to use Seravent after other broncho-dilators. I’m currently on Combivent which is a mixture of Atrovent and Ventolin. The way it was explained to me is that the Combivent works "from the outside in" and Seravent "from the inside out". I.E. you need to get your bronchial tubes as open as poss’ to get the Seravent down to where it does the most good. Brian

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Well Sir Brian… I read the accompanied brochure and indeed it does state,p "1. Do not use Serevent Inhalation Aerosol more frequently than two times daily, morning and evening, approximately 12 hours apart, at the recommended dose of two inhalations each time." There is another brochure which was also included on the product information but am sure you must have the same information to accompany your Serevent.   I just don’t wanna push my luck here as I have had a hard enough time having been diagnosed not too long ago.  Also I have hypertension and have noticed the the Serevent gives me a bit of a rush when I use it and my hands get a bit shakey but it is one thing I have noticed that really opens up the airways.  Am hoping I never get used to it because am feeling almost completely well for the moment.  I still have some mild aching in the chest but otherwise, I have not felt this good in a very long time. Thanks Brian for the advice and help.  I appreciated it all more then words can say. Always, pam – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (Pam) writes: Serevent – bronchidilater inhaler, 2 puffs, 2 times a day (to which the nurse added, ONLY 2 times a day!  Anymore will kill you!)   Oh dear – I’m on 2 puffs THREE times a day. Re’ the order of taking medication I was advised to use Seravent after other broncho-dilators. I’m currently on Combivent which is a mixture of Atrovent and Ventolin. The way it was explained to me is that the Combivent works "from the outside in" and Seravent "from the inside out". I.E. you need to get your bronchial tubes as open as poss’ to get the Seravent down to where it does the most good. Brian

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I took prednisone for a short while and it only made me eat like a horse.  I saw no difference in the breathing at all.  But then I not only have asthma, I also have emphysema it is a struggle to just put on clothes some days.  I use Serevent, two times a day, I use a nebulizeer about 3 to 4 times a day with two medications in it, albuterol and ipratropium bromide.  I also use an aerosol spray with that in it and I also use Ventolin and take Guaifensin la which thins the mucus and is an expectorant in pill form.  I also take coumadin for the blood clots I get if I don’t take it, I take high blood pressure pills and I also take ativan 3 or 4 times a day as I get these panic attacks when I can’t breathe….I also have the terrible cramps and at times I feel like I am going to throw up the pain is so bad. I didn’t want to stay on prednisone for a couple of reasons, one is the hunger it put into me and the second is that I read if you take it very long you will become a dibetic….scary thought with all the other things I have wrong with me….

Carol — Reading the list of side effects for many meds is scary. However, it pays to remember that it is a list of POSSIBLE side effects. Some people don’t contract any of them even though some do. Furthermore, just because someone encountered something on the list does not mean that you will if you take that med. And the frequency of appearance of a side effect is usually rather low, at least in those listings that I’ve seen. reble – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Carol Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with. This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Before you buy.

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Thought I would just let y’all know that after feeling horrible Monday and starting another tapered dose of Prednisone, I went to the doctor last night and have a new regiment to follow. Is something like this: Prednisone – 5 mg today and tomorrow. Am at the end of the tapering dosage. Proventil –  2 puffs, 4 times a day and as needed. Flovent 110 –  2 puffs, 2 times a day.

Flovent 110 4 pf/day is a Medium Dose (Medium is 2-6 pf/day). Frequently in coming off pred, a High Dose (6pf/day Flovent 110) is prescribed, then tapered as allowable. So if you have any problems, contact your doctor about increasing the Flovent, consider doubling it temporarily. Ref: Expert Panel Report 2 Fig 3-5b Serevent – bronchidilater inhaler, 2 puffs, 2 times a day (to which the nurse added, ONLY 2 times a day!  Anymore will kill you!)

That’s right; 2 pf x 2 is the MAXIMUM dose of Serevent. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Singulair – 1 pill in the evening, Tetracycline – antibiotic for the latest lung infection.  This time the doctor extended it to help avoid a recurrant episode. Was rereading over Ellis’s reply to my original post and was stated, "There are steroid sparing drugs; Serevent is one of them; usually 2 pf twice a day, morning and nite, at same time you take the Flovent [take Serevent first, wait 5 minutes then take Flovent]."  Because the doctor still has me taking a mandatory inhalation of Proventil, I took this and then preceded it with the Flovent.  Just before I leave the house this morning and like 15 minutes after I use these inhalers I will be taking the Serevent.  Or would it be more sensible to be taking the Proventil, then the Serevent, then the Flovent?  The doctor did not mention any order to which they should be done and I did not think to ask last night as I already had a zillion questions.

That sequence should be OK; Proventil & wait a minute or 2; then Flovent; and later Serevent. The order I use is Serevent first; wait 5-15 minutes (the Serevent initially reduces my peak flow til it starts taking effect in about 5-15 min); then inhaled steroid. Lastly, I use my Intal a few minutes later. I only use albuterol as needed. Ellis

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use Serevent, two times a day, I use a nebulizeer about 3 to 4 times a day with two medications in it, albuterol and ipratropium bromide.  I also use an aerosol spray with that in it and I also use Ventolin and take Guaifensin

BTW, Ventolin = albuterol. I noticed that you are not on any inhaled steroids, which is the standard of treatment for most asthma, especially asthma at the level of severity that yours appears to be.  Serevent is usually added AFTER inhaled steroids are being used. SW.

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Thought I would just let y’all know that after feeling horrible Monday and starting another tapered dose of Prednisone, I went to the doctor last night and have a new regiment to follow.   Is something like this: Prednisone – 5 mg today and tomorrow. Am at the end of the tapering dosage. Proventil –  2 puffs, 4 times a day and as needed. Flovent 110 –  2 puffs, 2 times a day. Serevent – bronchidilater inhaler, 2 puffs, 2 times a day (to which the nurse added, ONLY 2 times a day!  Anymore will kill you!)   Singulair – 1 pill in the evening, Tetracycline – antibiotic for the latest lung infection.  This time the doctor extended it to help avoid a recurrant episode. Was rereading over Ellis’s reply to my original post and was stated, "There are steroid sparing drugs; Serevent is one of them; usually 2 pf twice a day, morning and nite, at same time you take the Flovent [take Serevent first, wait 5 minutes then take Flovent]."  Because the doctor still has me taking a mandatory inhalation of Proventil, I took this and then preceded it with the Flovent.  Just before I leave the house this morning and like 15 minutes after I use these inhalers I will be taking the Serevent.  Or would it be more sensible to be taking the Proventil, then the Serevent, then the Flovent?  The doctor did not mention any order to which they should be done and I did not think to ask last night as I already had a zillion questions. Want to conclude with, I sure have a great doctor.  I mean, because I was his last patient of the evening and all he actually took the time and shot the balony with my husband and I.  Was wonderfully consoling and was not like most other doctors and in a hurry to leave with one hand on the door knob!   I think the biggest asset to prevailing over any disease is having a great doctor to help see you through.  As far as the quakery’s go and the other stuff I have read about through this newsgroup, I beleive in "tried and true" also.  This morning I am almost feeling GREAT!! Sorry for being long winded but would not have it any other way!! : ) pam – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with.   This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

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this is really getting to be sorta depressing.

i know how you feel, i had one horrible summer. Am thinking that by just going outside that I set myself up for all this.  why am i so hypersensitive with everything  I come into contact with nowadays? being outdoors, in traffic, in stores with smells and people with too much perfume?

i’ve found that once a really bad attack happens, i’m sensitive to every little thing for months and months afterward. especially if the attack is not/does not come under control easily. My husband swished the car window cleaner and the ammonia smell made me wanna jump into a hole.

it’s been so bad for me sometimes that i couldn’t even tolerate things like being around people who’d washed their hair with a certain type of shampoo, the smell of toothpaste or popcorn. . . basically everything. had to stay holed up in a filtered air conditioned room. I have been breathing for so long through my nose … well, I am determined to try anything and everything till something works.

it can be a long, hard road. i’m just finishing some prednisone which, by some miracle, actually seemed to do some good this time. and i ate more than i’ve eaten all year. last night i could breathe better than i have for months and months. it’s not as good tonight, but it’s not as bad either. just some last minute thoughts before i go off to bed. just thought i’d look in here since asthma’s been on my mind lately. had an attack recently right after an allergy shot, and when i went to get the shot today had to do the peak flow thingy. pretty sick of asthma. yep. had my bubble burst when i took allergy shots for years, which had cleared up all but exercise-induced asthma (i could even tolerate being around *smokers*), and now i’m right back where i started. only worse. only it’s getting better. well, very very slowly. sorry if this sounds depressing. best of luck, see ya. . .flames to follow, i’m sure. just ignore, i won’t be back for a while anyway.

Response:

I took prednisone for a short while and it only made me eat like a horse.  I saw no difference in the breathing at all.  But then I not only have asthma, I also have emphysema it is a struggle to just put on clothes some days.  I use Serevent, two times a day, I use a nebulizeer about 3 to 4 times a day with two medications in it, albuterol and ipratropium bromide.  I also use an aerosol spray with that in it and I also use Ventolin and take Guaifensin la which thins the mucus and is an expectorant in pill form.  I also take coumadin for the blood clots I get if I don’t take it, I take high blood pressure pills and I also take ativan 3 or 4 times a day as I get these panic attacks when I can’t breathe….I also have the terrible cramps and at times I feel like I am going to throw up the pain is so bad. I didn’t want to stay on prednisone for a couple of reasons, one is the hunger it put into me and the second is that I read if you take it very long you will become a dibetic….scary thought with all the other things I have wrong with me…. Carol – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with. This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Being that it is 3:10am in the morning and I woke up because I could not sleep.  Checked out my peak flow and am 100 or so below what I normally blow. Yesterday, had trouble with coughing, choking and the chest tightness, sore throat setting in so guess I will jump back to another prednisone burst starting with the 20 mg, then 10 mg  then continuing with the 5 mg till i see him on Monday the 11th. this is really getting to be sorta depressing.  Am thinking that by just going outside that I set myself up for all this.  why am i so hypersensitive with everything  I come into contact with nowadays? being outdoors, in traffic, in stores with smells and people with too much perfume?  My husband swished the car window cleaner and the ammonia smell made me wanna jump into a hole.  I have been breathing for so long through my nose … well, I am determined to try anything and everything till something works.  At least I am not in the hospital and I keep saying that to myself.  Thank goodness…

I think this is a step in the right direction for you. It will help you to accept the fact that you have a problem but it is not the worst of problems that people develop. My last trip to the emergency room was an eye opener for me. They were at capacity when I got there, and they brought in another bed for me. Then they made room for two more. The last person to come in sat on a chair — he had something in his eye that he couldn’t get out by himself. As it turned out, the last man in was the only one with whom I’d have been willing to trade places. The other poor souls were MUCH worse off than I was. Since then, my attitude has been far more positive, and I truly believe that it is helpful to maintain a good attitude even in the worst of times. It keeps us from piling frustration on top of the difficulty at hand. reble Sorry for venting out my frustrations on you all.  Will I ever get – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – this thing under control!? Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with. This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Before you buy.

Response:

Pam, I know how you feel and I go thru the same thing you described everyday and have for over nine years.The sensitivity  to every thing and every place is the pits I agree but I find  no releif either.  I thought I was much better last Jan. then we took a virus (my husband and myself) he is now on inhalers along with me and really understands when I say I cannot breathe.  I have been on many meds but they cause reactions and so I exist now , I do have a little hope with the flonase, in fact I got well enough to have a garage sale this pastt week,   When I can have a day that I sleep more than three hours, I feel like I received a gift from someone.  Every one has written that I am out of control, I am, I agree, how to get in control is not easy,  I do think the doc i have now has done what he can, and we have tried many different  meds, so far I have stayed out of the emergency room, my home may be sold and if God wills, I ‘ll move to Nv. or AZ.   really can not give up you know, hope you find your answers.  frannymae

FRAN’SHOME

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Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with.

Try to keep in mind that we do not all react the same way to treatment. By that, I mean that you shouldn’t expect your experiences to match up with those of others in all cases. There was a period (about 20 yrs ago) when I went through what you described here over and over until another Dr. finally left me on prednisone for a few weeks. During that time, I got stronger by enough that I didn’t immediately go back to being in trouble when I was tapered off. That lead to a period of my being considerably better off. Later, I entered a period when I needed prednisone continuously for about 7 years. Since coming off after that, I’ve been doing much, much better. I haven’t seen the emergency room for a very long time. Could this be your experience? Nobody can know because that much prednisone would kill lots of people through any of the many possible side effects. I’m genetically blessed to have been able to withstand it and benefit from it. You may not even be able to find a Dr. with guts enough to keep you on the stuff longer than a few days. The main thing I’m trying to get across is that you shouldn’t count on your responses to be the same as those of other people. reble This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Before you buy.

Response:

Being that it is 3:10am in the morning and I woke up because I could not sleep.  Checked out my peak flow and am 100 or so below what I normally blow. Yesterday, had trouble with coughing, choking and the chest tightness, sore throat setting in so guess I will jump back to another prednisone burst starting with the 20 mg, then 10 mg  then continuing with the 5 mg till i see him on Monday the 11th.   this is really getting to be sorta depressing.  Am thinking that by just going outside that I set myself up for all this.  why am i so hypersensitive with everything  I come into contact with nowadays? being outdoors, in traffic, in stores with smells and people with too much perfume?  My husband swished the car window cleaner and the ammonia smell made me wanna jump into a hole.  I have been breathing for so long through my nose … well, I am determined to try anything and everything till something works.  At least I am not in the hospital and I keep saying that to myself.  Thank goodness… Sorry for venting out my frustrations on you all.  Will I ever get this thing under control!?     – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with.   This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Response:

Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with.   This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Was wondering how long the effects last of oral prednisone treatment after dosage has been stopped.  Seems the doctor had me on a "burst," short time dosage and has been 4-5 days ago.  All is fine while I am on it and now that I have tapered off of it, seems I revert back to about where I was to begin with. This time, since he changed me over to the 110 mcg flovent, has been easier but seems like I have been borderline to an exacerbation. Especially when I have been outside for any length of time and running around doing errands in traffic, etc. Would Serevent therefore help alleviate this feeling?  I go back to the doctor next week and am seriously considering asking, although I do not look forward to "one more drug".

The effects of prednisone quickly stop within a day after the drug is stopped. You should be transitioned on to High Dose inhaled steroids; likely the Flovent 220. Of course the dose of Flovent 110 can be increased to control symptoms; this would be part of an Action Plan, which every asthmatic should have; to increase meds when symptoms get worse or peak flows drop below 80% personal best. There are steroid sparing drugs; Serevent is one of them; usually 2 pf twice a day, morning and nite, at same time you take the Flovent [take Serevent first, wait 5 minutes then take Flovent]. Multiple drugs can optimize the asthma treatment and minimize side effects. I take Pulmicort 1 pf x 2, Serevent, Intal, TheoDur, Singulair. The only drug I carry with me is albuterol; the others are taken at home morning and nite. Ellis

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Question:

Right now I am controlling my asthma with Venolin and Flovent (250).   I do notice that even on 4 puffs of Flovent a day I have some trouble – I use my ventolin inhaler about twice a day and its effect seems to only last about 2 hours or so before my peak flows start to dip again.

Then your asthma is not under control, and you need to go back to the doctor and work out a medication schedule that does get it controlled. Current standard guidelines are that one should need to use a rescue inhaler, other than prophylactically, only a couple of times a week at most. Chris Owens

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Patrick wrote << So I was thinking of going to my doctor and inquiring into Serevent since it is longer acting – or maybe Accolate/Singulair. My doctor told me it can take 2 to 3 weeks to see effects with singulair (I’m on it now) and finally I’m feeling better after a hellish summer.  He also said it does’nt work for everyone.  (He’s a pretty good doctor at Mass General Hosp. and Harvard Med. School and does asthma research-I’m pretty lucky to have him as an allergist I guess).I’ve heard good things about Singulair from people at work. I have a personal bias to see it succeed because I think Singulair was first developed (correct me if I’m wrong) by the Merck-Frosst group in Montreal (where I’m from). Jilly Evans the director of research there is a fabulously kind and wonderful person so if this is her success I’m really happy. For me Serevent seemed to have made my asthma worse (one of those rare examples of the paradoxical bronchospasms I guess?);but don’t take my example. One problem I find is that if you start too many new drugs at the same time and have a bad side effect from one of them it can be hard to figure out the cause. Chilla

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My hospital consultant swears by Seravent – perhaps because he took part in trials of it. I found that it was having litle effect at the initial dose of 4 puffs daily. The Doc. says it should last fot 12 hrs. but for some reason – especialy here in the west of Scotland it seems to last for less time with some people. Consequently he upped the dose to 2 puffs 3 time a day which has helped a bit although I am now experiencing side effects which include "the shakes" and some swelling around the neck. Re’  ventolin – I was changed to Combivent which is Ventolin plus Atrovent again some improvement but I was recently informed that the Atrovent content can cause prostate problems in men so it should not be used as a reliever.

Response:

I take Flovent and Serevent everyday.  My pulmonologist told me that the end of this year (Dec./Jan) they are going to combine Flovent and Serevent into one inhaler.  Just something to think about. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Right now I am controlling my asthma with Venolin and Flovent (250). I do notice that even on 4 puffs of Flovent a day I have some trouble – I use my ventolin inhaler about twice a day and its effect seems to only last about 2 hours or so before my peak flows start to dip again. So I was thinking of going to my doctor and inquiring into Serevent since it is longer acting – or maybe Accolate/Singulair.  When I was at the doctor one time she mentioned that Serevent is quite expensive which doesn’t thrill me especially since I am already taking Flovent $80/inhaler, Zoloft ($70/one month) and my ventolin and xanax which are actually quite cheap (hmm the two drugs that work right away are the cheapest – go figure).  Which do you think is the more effective Serevent or Singulair for controlling asthma.  And I hate to ask this – but which is the more affordable? I think the Serevent would be more dependable in reducing the need for Ventolin. However the Singulair would be worth trying too (don’t bother with Accolate which must be taken on empty stomach 2x/day). Singlair helps about 2/3 who try it, some quite dramatically. I don’t know the relative cost; however I do know a 30-day supply of Singulair is $78 US at Walgreens (they tried to charge me last time as my doctor’s justification had expired, I managed to get it renewed so just had the $5 copay.) If Singulair doesn’t help after a few days (my doctor suggested a 7-day trial) discontinue. The cost would also depend on the dosing; at 2 pf x2, a canister of Serevent lasts 30 days (120 pf/canister). Some take a reduced dose; 1 or 2 pf twice a day. I have found I only need to take Singulair every other day to get the maximum effect (off label prescribing). I take both Singulair and Serevent, along with Pulmicort Turb. and theophylline SR and Intal. If cost is a big factor, you might consider theophylline SR, it’s fairly cheap; I take 200 mg x 2. Several studies have show low-dose theophylline SR is effective as a steroid- reducing drug. I don’t think the Intal helps a lot, but it helps some. (2 pf 2 or 3x) Ellis

Response:

I take Flovent and Serevent everyday.  My pulmonologist told me that the end of this year (Dec./Jan) they are going to combine Flovent and Serevent into one inhaler.  Just something to think about.

I’m not so sure that’s a good idea — at least for those of us with severe asthma who sometimes need to use extra puffs of Flovent for a few days to keep from having to go on oral prednisone. I think taking 4 puffs of the combination would give you *way* too much Serevent. Anyone have better information on this issue? Emily Knit a hug, crochet a cuddle, sew a smile. http://www.newbornsinneed.org

Response:

think taking 4 puffs of the combination would give you *way* too much Serevent. Anyone have better information on this issue?

Good point. Especially if you use 4 puffs of Flovent on a regular basis.

Response:

I always thought most people took Serevent before the Flovent but I guess that is not always the case.  That is too bad the combination won’t work for you.  I have had pretty bad asthma since childhood but never really relied on Flovent while feeling bad.  Usually have to take more Albuterol treatments.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I’m not so sure that’s a good idea — at least for those of us with severe asthma who sometimes need to use extra puffs of Flovent for a few days to keep from having to go on oral prednisone. I think taking 4 puffs of the combination would give you *way* too much Serevent. Anyone have better information on this issue? Emily Knit a hug, crochet a cuddle, sew a smile. http://www.newbornsinneed.org

Response:

I always thought most people took Serevent before the Flovent but I guess that is not always the case.  That is too bad the combination won’t work for you.  I have had pretty bad asthma since childhood but never really relied on Flovent while feeling bad.  Usually have to take more Albuterol treatments.

Michelle, I’m not sure you understood my message. Let me try to explain better what I meant. First, I would *never* rely on Flovent to relieve an attack. That is not its purpose, and, in fact, it *won’t* do that. The role of Flovent in asthma treatment is *preventive*. Steroids relieve and/or prevent the inflammation that causes the breathing distress. In an acute exacerbation, I sometimes have to take oral steroids (prednisone), or in a really bad case, IV steroids (solumedrol). As you know, these forms of cortisone/cortisol do a good job of damping down the asthma, but at a cost — used in high doses over time, they have serious side effects. Flovent is a steroid spray. Because it goes directly to the lungs, it bypasses the digestive and other systems and seems to have fewer  side effects than the oral or IV forms of the medicine. In most treatment protocols, Flovent or another inhaled steroid is usually prescribed as the first line of defense. Used daily, it seems to keep down inflammation and thus to prevent or delay airways remodeling. I use Flovent twice daily — morning and evenning — usually 2 puffs each time. It *does not* have a bronchodilator effect or elevate my peak flow. But if I didn’t take it for a few days, I would have more and worse episodes of wheezing. Sometimes, for various reasons, I get into periods of more trouble and have to go on the systemic forms of steroids to break the downward cycle. That usually helps, in time — never an immediate rescue — but with all the disadvantages of major side effects. Now, the neat thing is that on *some* — but not all– occasiona, if I feel this happening, I can stave off the use of the dreaded systemic steroids by increasing my puffs of Flovent to 3 or even 4 twice a day. Note that this is a calcualted risk. I am still getting more steroid than I would ideally want to have, but it is better to get a bit more of the local variety than to take a hit with the big guns. This is with my doctor’s advice and blessing. Now about Serevent — I keep Albuterol on hand for emergency relief. It acts practically immediately and can be repeated at intervals if needed, since its period of action is relatively short. Serevent is in the same family of drugs as Albuterol, and, in fact, doesn’t do anything different except that it acts more slowly and over a longer period of time. Because of the 12-hour length of action, it is all to easy to get *too much* Serevent, and when it first came out, deaths from overdoses were reported in the press. So — I can and will from time to time double my dose of Flovent and keep off Prednisone, but I *never* want to double my dose of Serevent. (And I *never* reach first for the Serevent when I’m having real trouble. The Albuterol is much faster.) That’s why I never want to used them in a combined form, because I would lose the ability to titrate the Flovent without ODing on the Serevent. By the way, I’m not sure it really matters which one you take first, unless you want to wait 30 minutes or so after the Serevent to let it take effect before puffing the Flovent. I hope this makes sense. Emily Knit a hug, crochet a cuddle, sew a smile. http://www.newbornsinneed.org

Response:

Right now I am controlling my asthma with Venolin and Flovent (250).   I do notice that even on 4 puffs of Flovent a day I have some trouble – I use my ventolin inhaler about twice a day and its effect seems to only last about 2 hours or so before my peak flows start to dip again. So I was thinking of going to my doctor and inquiring into Serevent since it is longer acting – or maybe Accolate/Singulair.  When I was at the doctor one time she mentioned that Serevent is quite expensive which doesn’t thrill me especially since I am already taking Flovent $80/inhaler, Zoloft ($70/one month) and my ventolin and xanax which are actually quite cheap (hmm the two drugs that work right away are the cheapest – go figure).  Which do you think is the more effective Serevent or Singulair for controlling asthma.  And I hate to ask this – but which is the more affordable?

Response:

Right now I am controlling my asthma with Venolin and Flovent (250). I do notice that even on 4 puffs of Flovent a day I have some trouble – I use my ventolin inhaler about twice a day and its effect seems to only last about 2 hours or so before my peak flows start to dip again. So I was thinking of going to my doctor and inquiring into Serevent since it is longer acting – or maybe Accolate/Singulair.  When I was at the doctor one time she mentioned that Serevent is quite expensive which doesn’t thrill me especially since I am already taking Flovent $80/inhaler, Zoloft ($70/one month) and my ventolin and xanax which are actually quite cheap (hmm the two drugs that work right away are the cheapest – go figure).  Which do you think is the more effective Serevent or Singulair for controlling asthma.  And I hate to ask this – but which is the more affordable?

I think the Serevent would be more dependable in reducing the need for Ventolin. However the Singulair would be worth trying too (don’t bother with Accolate which must be taken on empty stomach 2x/day). Singlair helps about 2/3 who try it, some quite dramatically. I don’t know the relative cost; however I do know a 30-day supply of Singulair is $78 US at Walgreens (they tried to charge me last time as my doctor’s justification had expired, I managed to get it renewed so just had the $5 copay.) If Singulair doesn’t help after a few days (my doctor suggested a 7-day trial) discontinue. The cost would also depend on the dosing; at 2 pf x2, a canister of Serevent lasts 30 days (120 pf/canister). Some take a reduced dose; 1 or 2 pf twice a day. I have found I only need to take Singulair every other day to get the maximum effect (off label prescribing). I take both Singulair and Serevent, along with Pulmicort Turb. and theophylline SR and Intal. If cost is a big factor, you might consider theophylline SR, it’s fairly cheap; I take 200 mg x 2. Several studies have show low-dose theophylline SR is effective as a steroid- reducing drug. I don’t think the Intal helps a lot, but it helps some. (2 pf 2 or 3x) Ellis

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Question:

Neil, thanks for this information. I have already been through many tests for reflux (which I have, but is now under control)and many other things including the ones you mentioned. I cannot consider methatrexate because I have a pre-existing liver abnormality (Which has only been diagnosed as a abnormality, what it actually is the doctors do not know. I have had so many tests including a biopsy, which draw to no conclusions. They know what it isn’t, but the do not know what it is.)and my doctor has stated that methatrexate has a grater risk factor (Compared to Cyclosporine) when it comes to liver damageing side effects. My doctors (Asthma specialist and Gastroentronologist) strongly advise me against using Methatrexate, and therfore Cyclosporine is "my last option". Once again, thanks for the information, I found it to be very helpful. –Mandy Simmons – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Since the recognition that asthma is an inflammatory disease interest in alternate anti-inflammatory medications has been around.  Steroids (prednisone etc) work best.  In fact when they don’t work, an alternate diagnosis should be considered. (gastroesophageal reflux, vocal cord dysfunction, tracheal stenosis etc etc etc.)  When all else fails though other drugs like cyclosporin have been used. The most common is methotrexate.  Popularized by several studies in the New England journal in the late 80’s it’s use was somewhat debunked when The National Jewish Hospital in Colorado published a great study in Annals of Internal Medicine showing it didn’t work.  Since then though, others (myself included) have tried it with some modicum of success. Cyclosporin is similarly anti-inflammatory.  Good studies in asthma are lacking and most evidence in the literature is anecdotal.  It is expensive and has a lot of side effects.  Not a BAD choice, but be certain all alternate diagnoses have been ruled out and at least discuss options like methotrexate with your doctor.  Consider a second opinion as well. Hope that’s helpful I have been on high doses of Prednisolone for a very long time. I have tried a new medication, Singulair, and others, with no relief. I suffer symptoms every day, and want a better quality of life. I have been discussing the use of cyclosporin with my specialist and will (If i don’t change my mind) be starting to take the medication next month. I have been searching for information on the use of cyclo with asthma, and have only been able to find info on cyclo used with other conditions. I want to know if any asthmatics have used cyclo, their side effects and how useful they have found it to be. —Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.—

Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.

Response:

Since the recognition that asthma is an inflammatory disease interest in alternate anti-inflammatory medications has been around.  Steroids (prednisone etc) work best.  In fact when they don’t work, an alternate diagnosis should be considered. (gastroesophageal reflux, vocal cord dysfunction, tracheal stenosis etc etc etc.)  When all else fails though other drugs like cyclosporin have been used. The most common is methotrexate.  Popularized by several studies in the New England journal in the late 80’s it’s use was somewhat debunked when The National Jewish Hospital in Colorado published a great study in Annals of Internal Medicine showing it didn’t work.  Since then though, others (myself included) have tried it with some modicum of success. Cyclosporin is similarly anti-inflammatory.  Good studies in asthma are lacking and most evidence in the literature is anecdotal.  It is expensive and has a lot of side effects.  Not a BAD choice, but be certain all alternate diagnoses have been ruled out and at least discuss options like methotrexate with your doctor.  Consider a second opinion as well. Hope that’s helpful – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I have been on high doses of Prednisolone for a very long time. I have tried a new medication, Singulair, and others, with no relief. I suffer symptoms every day, and want a better quality of life. I have been discussing the use of cyclosporin with my specialist and will (If i don’t change my mind) be starting to take the medication next month. I have been searching for information on the use of cyclo with asthma, and have only been able to find info on cyclo used with other conditions. I want to know if any asthmatics have used cyclo, their side effects and how useful they have found it to be. —Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.—

Response:

I have been on high doses of Prednisolone for a very long time. I have tried a new medication, Singulair, and others, with no relief. I suffer symptoms every day, and want a better quality of life. I have been discussing the use of cyclosporin with my specialist and will (If i don’t change my mind) be starting to take the medication next month. I have been searching for information on the use of cyclo with asthma, and have only been able to find info on cyclo used with other conditions. I want to know if any asthmatics have used cyclo, their side effects and how useful they have found it to be. —Share what you know. Learn what you don’t.—

Response:

I have been on high doses of Prednisolone for a very long time. I have tried a new medication, Singulair, and others, with no relief. I suffer symptoms every day, and want a better quality of life. I have been discussing the use of cyclosporin with my specialist and will (If i don’t change my mind) be starting to take the medication next month. I have been searching for information on the use of cyclo with asthma, and have only been able to find info on cyclo used with other conditions. I want to know if any asthmatics have used cyclo, their side effects and how useful they have found it to be.

You may benefit from a 2nd opinion from National Jewish Center. Here’s a link on steroid-resistant asthma: http://www.njc.org/MSU/13n2MSU_StRe_Asthma.html Steroid-Resistant Asthma by Donald Y.M. Leung, M.D., Ph.D., & Stanley S. Szefler, M.D. Excerpt: "Once a primary-care physician identifies a likely SR patient  it is important that the patient be referred to a center such as National Jewish that specializes in managing these  cases. Our institution is the foremost center in the United States doing research on the etiology and pathogenesis  of SR asthma. As of now there are no clear alternatives to oral steroids  for treating patients with SR asthma. Our group has had some success using combined treatment with troleandomycin  and methylprednisolone in several SR patients. This regimen led to normalization of T cell sensitivity.  Another group has reported success using cyclosporine to improve the symptoms of patients with SR asthma. Other  potentially useful agents include methotrexate, gold, intravenous gamma globulin, hydroxychloroquine, dapsone,  and interferon-y. " This page is produced by the National Jewish Medical and  Research Center, 1400 Jackson Street, Denver, Colorado 80206.    Call LUNG LINE

Question:

Does anyone have an opinion on Propane vs. Electricity Mainly for Stove, Dryer and possible fireplace. Thanks

Response:

Does anyone have an opinion on Propane vs. Electricity Mainly for Stove, Dryer and possible fireplace. Thanks

   A few unscientific observations …. – ugly propane tanks beside your home  ($ 43/year rental) – slightly cheaper than electricity for home heating (fuel-wise) – more expensive than NG or oil  (at the moment) – hot water tank rental, if you go LP for that too ($ 115/year) – carbon monoxide worries (if you’re a worrier) – appliance repair/service for stove & clothes dryer is more   troublesome (electric ones are easy to fix-it-yourself) – serious chefs prefer gas stoves. (so I hear)  This is based on southern Ontario prices, Canadian dollars.    John T.

Response:

Does anyone have an opinion on Propane vs. Electricity Mainly for Stove, Dryer and possible fireplace. Thanks

I converted my water heater to propane and dryer to propane. My electric bill dropped from $100 to $60. My gas bill is around $25.   It cost $110 in parts alone to install the gas heater.  The gas line was there, the vent pipe was not.)   In the long run it was a good decision, in the short run it was an expensive one. It will take some time to offset the cost.   However when the power goes off, which in this area is often due to snow. I have hot water to take a shower in. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -grin<

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (malloc) writes: your right…even years later…but these "symtoms" are NOT physical   true withdrawl from hard narcotics lasts from 12-100 hours..and has nothing  to do with the amount of time using(1 year vs 30 years)…but only with the volume of drug  consumed(steady daily blood level)….i know this because i lived it..for a long long time… Sid Sid..or whoever….how much of this "withdrawal" do you think is actually physical vs. psychological symptoms….Maybe that is where the confusion is coming in… like tobacco..I am told the physical part lasts ~24 hours…but the emotional can go on forever…see what I am saying? Hope that made sense…..Since you have been thru it..and others…what is your

Hi rae….your right about that….most of it is in your head after a certain amout of time…..you come to rely on the pills(or whatever) and sometimes you feel more pain when stopping them..its all emotional..like any repetitious pleasant behavoiur.or stimuli.. as for it going on forever….ill be honest…the intensity of certain drugs (in large doses…IV) haunts me(and every other abuser) everyday.. and i imagine always will……narcotics when abused are a serious trap (just like booze or any pleasant act(sex…)…but the chronic pain sufferer who is not using to get "high" is a whole different story.. Sid

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thusly – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -X-No-Archive: Yes thusly X-No-Archive: Yes Been off Loratab 10 for 7 days and the withdrawal isn’t any better, was taking up to 8 tablets a day.  any suggestions, words of wisdom sure would be appreciated. Thank you Terri Terri:  I feel your pain but I must say it will take 21 to 31 days to pass.  You might try some Imodium tablets for the diahrrea (sic). Just stopping that can help a bunch.  Load up on vitamins, especially b’s and c. Tell how you feel to people like Gretchen who think there’s a difference in reaction when narcotics are taken for pain rather than recreationally.  You hurt like hell, and I wish I could help…I do. Hang in there, your strength will slowly start coming around and you’ll feel better. This is just garbage..pure and simple….you talk like shes detoxing off   of heroin…..and even that is a few days of discomfort  People have all kinds of problems when abruptly stopping some meds    but most are very minor…..i dont think 21 days of 10 mg hydrocodone   a day is not gonna 20 days to kick…more like 2 or 3…   ive detoxed from them all…from dilaudid to darvon (in very large doses)   and felt a little "uneasy" for a few days…most of this was in my head..   these "mild" narcotics(oxycodone….hydrocodone) just dont produce   the "severe" withdrawl that the "major" narcotics do…..they arent taken   in massive doses and they are just to weak..   as i mentioned before..i have friends who take 1000mg hydrocodone a day   (to get high…why else)…they can stop(and often do) and not feel a thing..   A person using them for pain management certainly isnt gonna feel   ill for 30 days   Sid Sid:  People who have yet to totally trash their minds on dope have a stiffer time with withdrawal than you guys with scrambled brains who can’t face reality.  Your perspective is so far from the norm that it’s hardly valid anylonger.

  My "perspective" is one of experience…..just because ive used pain medication in the past for emotional pain doesnt invalidate anything… Dont be so quick to label me..the drug i was into is exactly the same substance going into your spinal canal…AND into eveyones mouth or by patch….all the same because a doctor is your "pusher" means nothing doesnt make you righteous. Sid

Response:

Been off Loratab 10 for 7 days and the withdrawal isn’t any better, was taking up to 8 tablets a day.  any suggestions, words of wisdom sure would be appreciated. Thank you Terri

Response:

This extended period of "withdrawel" is not customary given the facts be something else going on and, he should be able to tell you how to diminish your symptoms. (The benzos …..and in some cases alcohol,can result in a very long and dangerous period of withdrawal but unless your system is for some reason unusually sensitive – not the past quantity of Lortab that you have been using.) Be sure that you are eating properly….better to overeat than undereat at this time……and drink gallons of fresh water.  Good luck.

Response:

I appreciate more than you could possibly know everybody’s response to my original question. In JC’s defense, I think he realizes that no 2 people are the same and what works for one may or may not work for another.  And withdrawal varies also…  I think, no I know i have an addictive personality and maybe that is why i’m having such a hard time getting off the Loracet 10’s.  What surprised me most, is that i felt ( i may be wrong here) that most didn’t think taking 8 to 10 of these tablets a day was alot.  I am new to newsgroups so if i’m not posting correctly please let me know what i’m doing wrong.  I really like this group and would like to become a regular part of it.  I’m going back to work today, but i did fall out the wagon and took 2 loracets this morning, talked to my doctor and he’s changing me to Ultram… could the group give me their thoughts on this drug? Thank you all for your time and support Terri

Response:

thusly .  Morphine addicts of 2 years can still be showing signs of withdrawal after 6 or 8 months.

 your right…even years later…but these "symtoms" are NOT physical    true withdrawl from hard narcotics lasts from 12-100 hours..and has nothing   to do with the amount of time using(1 year vs 30 years)…but only with the volume of drug   consumed(steady daily blood level)….i know this because i lived it..for  a long long time…  Sid – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –

Response:

(malloc) writes: your right…even years later…but these "symtoms" are NOT physical   true withdrawl from hard narcotics lasts from 12-100 hours..and has nothing  to do with the amount of time using(1 year vs 30 years)…but only with the volume of drug  consumed(steady daily blood level)….i know this because i lived it..for a long long time… Sid

Sid..or whoever….how much of this "withdrawal" do you think is actually physical vs. psychological symptoms….Maybe that is where the confusion is coming in… like tobacco..I am told the physical part lasts ~24 hours…but the emotional can go on forever…see what I am saying? Hope that made sense…..Since you have been thru it..and others…what is your

Response:

Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet. "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

Response:

Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes.

There is no such thing as "mild" diabetes. He may mean that you have "prediabetes", but I suspect that what he means is that you are at the low end of the "diagnostic range." In other words, you have diabetes and there is nothing "mild" about it, regardless of what your BG levels are. The only people that use the term "mild diabetes" are those that don’t have it. If left uncontrolled, diabetes is a very unpleasant disease. The good news is that it can be managed. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise,

If you are prediabetic, then you may be able to slow your progression to diabetes, or even prevent it altogether. If you are diabetic then yes, you may very well be able to control it with diet and exercise. In my observation and (limited) experience, the best thing by far is exercise. he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff.

Yes. Apparently. I think you should take it. It doesn’t mean that you have to be on it forever. The idea with taking glucophage at the moment is to try and get your glucose regulation mechanisms working again. Apart from all the other problems it causes, high blood glucose gums up the works of your pancreas. Your pancreas is almost certainly damaged and that cannot be reversed, but if you get your BG levels down, the parts that are still going can work more effectively. Once your BG regulation is patched up, you can try weaning yourself off the glucophage. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too.

Are you taking steroid medications for your asthma? My understanding is that steroids promote insulin resistance (which is the heart of the problem for Type 2 diabetics). You should talk to your doctor about how your asthma treatment will affect your diabetes and vice versa. In fact, you should probably arrange to see an endocrinologist or diabetologist if you haven’t already done so. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage.

192 is certainly higher than you would like it, but at this early post-diagnostic stage you should not be worried too much about peaks. Certainly you should try and limit them, but I suggest you focus on your morning and pre-meal levels. So long as they are in the normal range you are doing very well. One thing to do when you have a peak is go for a walk. While you are exercising, your muscles do not need insulin to take up glucose. It’s like they are so desperate for glucose that they don’t need any insulin. So if you are high, going for a brisk 20 minute walk is a great way to bring your levels down. Even a 5 or 10 minute walk will have a noticeable effect. Ideally you should time your walk to start *before* you hit your peak. So, if you have meal with a lot of sugars or carbohydrates, go for a walk half an hour after you start eating. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning…..

Probably. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet.

It’s not just sugar you need to be careful with. It’s carbohydrates – sugar is just one form of carbohydrate. And not all carbohydrates are bad. Things like sugar, white bread and potatoes will push your BG levels up very high in a very short period of time – which you don’t want. Other things like pasta or wholegrain bread will give you a much lower and gentler rise – much better. Go to your bookstore or library and try to find a book on the "Glycemic Index" (GI) which is a rating of how a given food will affect your BG levels. The GI "bible" is called "The (new) Glucose Revolution" by Jennie Brand-Miller. Basically you want to stick to foods with a low GI and avoid foods with a high GI. On the subject of books, you should invest in a copy of "Diabetes for Dummies" by Alan Rubin or, "The First Year Type 2" by Gretchen Becker. Get both if you can manage it. Cheers, John Carney.

Response:

cc’d by email You probably need a new doctor You need a LOT of information, AND, you need to test, how often depends on a lot of factors. What was your fasting BG ?? what was your A1c?  You need to KNOW these things.  Any doctor who doesn’t tell you is suspect. NEXT, diet.  He SHOULD have sent you to a dietitian, any doctor who doesn’t is suspect.  You can eat sugar, but the COOKIES were probably pretty bad for you.  Lots of people here are "saved" by one or another diets which they follow religiously, and often think are the ONLY way, but, at the risk of getting int the diet wars. ALL calories turn into blood glucose.  some faster than others.  Carbs in particular go into the blood stream fast, and can cause spikes. Sugar is a simple carb, but no worse than most other carbs.  Be particularly wary of "sugar free" things, which contain tons of carbs, and are often worse for you that a spoon of sugar. There is sure to be a hospital in your area which has a 1-3 day "introduction to Diabetes’ session for new diabetics – the cost usually runs about $400-$500, and is covered by most insurance. Third: Meds.  You MUST take meds when they are appropriate.  Holding off is NOT good for you.  If the doctor had done a good job, he would have explained things.  AFTER you are under control, THEN you can cut back on meds Forth: Testing – You need a meter, and should test regularly.  AGAIN, the doctor failed you here.  I test 4 or more times a day to stay under control, you may be able to get away with once every few days. Fifth: EXERCISE – probably one of the most important things for a diabetic.  Even when they tell you to exercise, they don’t usually REALLY make you understand how much it helps. !!!!!! The MOST important thing is a competent physician, who answers questions, keeps you informed, and gives good advice.  You do NOT have that – it is CRITICAL.  An Endo is preferable, but, a good Family Practitioner or Internist is often quite adequate. !!!!! After that, stay on the group, ignore the various wars, dodge the spammers and scammers who have miracle cures, and get more questions to ask your doctor.  Then ASK him or her.  Don’t run off half cocked because someone on the internet says "it works for me".  Use this as a resource to find suggustions to clear with your medical team. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet. "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

Response:

people that use the term "mild diabetes" are those that don’t have it. If

Then I guess I don’t have it.  :-) Yes. Apparently. I think you should take it. It doesn’t mean that you have to be on it forever. The idea with taking glucophage at the moment is to try and get your glucose regulation mechanisms working again. Apart from all the

I would _not_ reject this advice, but I would question it. If your blood sugar levels are high, and A1c shows they have been high for some time, then medicine might be a good idea. On the other hand, it turned out to be a bad idea for me–mine got down to near normal levels with only exercise, and then stayed down with good diet. You didn’t say what the numbers actually are.  You should look at the actual numbers, get more detailed information from your doctor, and perhaps additional information from another doctor or other sources. This newsgroup is a good source BUT be careful–like all of Usenet, we have our fair share of nutcases. 192 is certainly higher than you would like it, but at this early

Oops, I didn’t see this number in the original post. But I went back and looked.  This is high enough to cause damage if prolonged, but it would not surprise me to see that number in anyone only an hour after     "a small box of chocolate cookies, a      deli sandwich, and … a bottle of wine" especially if "deli sandwich" means one of those subs with about a cubic foot of white bread! On the subject of books, you should invest in a copy of "Diabetes for Dummies" by Alan Rubin or, "The First Year Type 2" by Gretchen Becker. Get both if you can manage it.

Both excellent ones.  I bet you could find both (and others) at a library, go through them quickly and then decide which one(s) you want to buy and read again.  I would also recommend Richard Bernstein’s latest book, BUT only after learning a little more.  Bernstein is a little extreme, so it would be good to know a little bit first so he doesn’t take you off the deep end.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet. "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

And a quick word about ketones. You’re a Type 2, so ketones shouldn’t be a problem. Diabetic ketoacidosis in Type 1s is caused by lack of insulin, not *necessarily* high bg readings, but the two usually go hand-in-hand. A Type 2 is insulin resistant, meaning they have lots of insulin the body can’t use properly. There are exceptions to this, of course. Unless you’ve had a c-peptide test that says you’re not producing insulin (in which case you’d be on injections), then ketones are one less thing to worry about. I don’t think ketones from DKA or dietary ketosis is bad for the kidneys, Atkins people test for ketones to see if they’re burning fat for fuel. They’re in dietary ketosis, not diabetic ketoacidosis. As for the cookies…Not a good thing, but hey, we’re human. Live and learn. Vicki

Response:

    I don’t think ketones from DKA or dietary ketosis is bad for the   kidneys, Atkins people test for ketones to see if they’re burning fat   for fuel. They’re in dietary ketosis, not diabetic ketoacidosis.     As for the cookies…Not a good thing, but hey, we’re human. Live and   learn.     Vicki DKA is  Diabetic KetoAcidosis. BDK is Benign Dietary Ketosis. DKA is BAD. BDK is not. If your blood glucose is normal and you show ketones, it indicates that your body has no available glucose to use as fuel and must dip into its store of ketones to use as fuel. This condition is called either ketosis or benign dietary ketosis (BDK). If your blood glucose is high (over 240) and you are showing ketones, it is bad. In the absence of insulin, your body cannot use the glucose in your blood for fuel. It will begin to break down the fat or muscle in your body for fuel. This produces ketones. These ketones will spill over into your kidneys and trigger urine production, which will dehydrate you very fast. The combination of high blood glucose, ketones, and dehydration is called diabetic ketoacidosis (DKA). You will experience some or all of these symptoms: extreme thirst, stomach pain, nausea, vomiting, dry mouth, dry and flushed skin, fatigue, fever, drowsiness, frequent urination, and labored breathing. If DKA persists untreated, it can result in coma or death. Over 1,700 insulin dependent diabetics, mostly children, die every year of DKA. Jennifer

Response:

you have mild diabetes as long as you dont binge on anything, You are a diabetic and I am sure of that, We would all love it if we could be med free,  but unless you are absolutely sure that you wont have that need for the whole box of cookies or bottle of wine, I would go on the meds,  but remember being on meds doesnt give you a license to overindulge,  You can still have spikes,  Also it is total carbs and not just sugar that we watch, Last night ,  the dinner I had prepared diidnt call my name so I decided I was going to have a bowl of cold cereal and two slices pumpernickel bread,  I started at 100 and at two hours I was 200 which is a very big spike to me. I am on glucophage so perhaps I would have been 400.  Just taking meds doesnt mean you dont have to watch the carbs. Loretta In tribute to the United States of America and the State of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and terrorism.

Response:

This post not CC’d by email Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th.

G’day G’day Dave,   Glad to see you are testing and watching your diet and have had the two tests required for diagnosis. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes.

Having MILD diabetes is like taking a SMALL step off a ledge on a talk building … or being slightly pregnant.  It may take a little longer for the full realisation to occur but you are diabetic though probably not as advanced as some at time of diagnosis. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too.

For what it is worth I have been diagnosed as an asthmatic longer ago than I care to remember. As it happens the diagnosis of diabetes was actually very beneficial to me in regards to asthma control.  I got given the once over and tested on a machine that plotted a graph of air flow over a period of time.  Amazingly although I had a peak flow that was higher than ninety something percent of the population I wasn’t getting adequate flow after the initial peak flow.  Since we are talking about dealing with glucose in the blood it is important to get the other half of the process, oxygen utilisation, top notch as well. glucose + oxygen – carbon dioxide + water + energy released. Unless you are taking some sort of steroid tablets (unusual except in emergencies) it is really unlikely the asthma medication will cause problems with your diabetic control.   The good results for me ONLY came about because I was sent to specialists who overturned the inaccurate diagnoses and consequent inadequate prescribing of many GPs.  IMHO rather than shying away from taking glucophage as a personal, partially informed decision, perhaps now is the time to get a specialist make over that will bring all doctors who are treating you and yourself onto the same page.         Since then (Jan 15)

after the second confirmatory test. my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys.

You have used terms like "normal range" and "danger level"   You might have the same concept of these terms as I have or you might not. Others might differ in their usage from mine.   So we are all safely on the same page it makes sense to attach numbers to these statements. FWIIW we have had some doctors who use phrases like ‘mild diabetes’ who have very lax ideas about what constitutes "normal range". I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies,

Couldn’t?   "Didn’t" I think we’d accept as a valid description of what happened. "Couldn’t resist" implies you were somehow incompetent.  I watch a bit of Judge Judy sometimes while I’m eating my evening meal.  Now I’m trying to picture Judge Judy asking you to look straight at her and repeat that assertion.     and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet.

If you intend doing it without glucophage or other oral meds then one has to come to terms with the fact that exercise means A LOT of EXCERCISE.   — Quentin Grady       ^  ^  / New Zealand,       #,#< [                     / /     "… and the blind dog was leading." http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/quentin

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th.  The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that  I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise,  he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a  deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to

If that is a bad it was after pouring all that on, your diabetes is really mild. Forget about Glucophage.  People should only take any such medication on a permanent basis when there is no other choice.  There is the risk of cummulative toxic effect with taking any chemical. If 192 mg/dl worries you, just curb your temptation for a box of chocolate cookies–they did most of it to you.  The deli sandwich and the bottle of wine had a minimal effect on you.  You just have to shun sweets and you (and I mean just YOU) won’t have to worry, at least for the time being.  However, you should spot check your blood sugars, several times a month at least.  Your "mild" diabetes could develop into something worse.  But by watching your diet, and your weight, you can greatly improve the odds in your favor. Take care… Michel PS Normal blood sugar is fasting in the morning, 60-110 mg/dl, yet never over 125.  One hour after eating a full meal, up to 140 mg/dl, sometimes even 150. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid,  perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet. "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too.

There is no such thing as mild diabetes.  You either have it or you don’t. If your Dr. is using such terms you should consider getting another Dr. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning…..

Avoiding sugars isn’t the approach to diabetes.  It is watching the amount of carbs that we eat. I really think you should see a dietician who will help you with the diet. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet.

Try not to bring those things into the house.  Or if you do, buy only a very small quantity.  It’s more difficult for me now that I have a family.  I sometimes buy things for them that I’d rather not have in the house.  But when I was home alone, if I bought sweets, I almost always bought them from the bulk section so I could buy just a couple of pieces at a time. — Type 2 http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/ Julie Bove, posting from new account

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I love your signature line,,,, I am take in the Glucophage, I have asthma, and I am 52 They put me on ADVAIR about 3 months ago. WONDER DRUG for me! I take a hit in the morning and one in the evening. I have stopped using the inhalers and Uniphyl which I was on for 10 years.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet.

____ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

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just a bit on the exercise part, I tested 9.9 a lttle while ago (due to eating some pizza) I knew it was not good for me but these things happen occasionally. Anyway I went for a brisk walk of two city blocks , about all I can do at one time  and in 12 minutes my bg was down to 8.7  excersise is soooo important. Dave (I’m workin’ on it ) Milk

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – cc’d by email You probably need a new doctor You need a LOT of information, AND, you need to test, how often depends on a lot of factors. What was your fasting BG ?? what was your A1c?  You need to KNOW these things.  Any doctor who doesn’t tell you is suspect. NEXT, diet.  He SHOULD have sent you to a dietitian, any doctor who doesn’t is suspect.  You can eat sugar, but the COOKIES were probably pretty bad for you.  Lots of people here are "saved" by one or another diets which they follow religiously, and often think are the ONLY way, but, at the risk of getting int the diet wars. ALL calories turn into blood glucose.  some faster than others.  Carbs in particular go into the blood stream fast, and can cause spikes. Sugar is a simple carb, but no worse than most other carbs.  Be particularly wary of "sugar free" things, which contain tons of carbs, and are often worse for you that a spoon of sugar. There is sure to be a hospital in your area which has a 1-3 day "introduction to Diabetes’ session for new diabetics – the cost usually runs about $400-$500, and is covered by most insurance. Third: Meds.  You MUST take meds when they are appropriate.  Holding off is NOT good for you.  If the doctor had done a good job, he would have explained things.  AFTER you are under control, THEN you can cut back on meds Forth: Testing – You need a meter, and should test regularly.  AGAIN, the doctor failed you here.  I test 4 or more times a day to stay under control, you may be able to get away with once every few days. Fifth: EXERCISE – probably one of the most important things for a diabetic.  Even when they tell you to exercise, they don’t usually REALLY make you understand how much it helps. !!!!!! The MOST important thing is a competent physician, who answers questions, keeps you informed, and gives good advice.  You do NOT have that – it is CRITICAL.  An Endo is preferable, but, a good Family Practitioner or Internist is often quite adequate. !!!!! After that, stay on the group, ignore the various wars, dodge the spammers and scammers who have miracle cures, and get more questions to ask your doctor.  Then ASK him or her.  Don’t run off half cocked because someone on the internet says "it works for me".  Use this as a resource to find suggustions to clear with your medical team. Hi, I talked you you guy before. I’ve been testing my BGL with a monitor and watching my diet, since a Doctor hinted that I have diabetes. I took a Blood test around Jan 2, 2003, and had a follow up appointment on the 15th. The Doctor didn’t sound too enthusiastic about his diagnosis …but he said that I had MILD diabetes. He said that it would be controlled with Diet and exercise, he was going to offer me a prescription of "Glucophage", but I declined. I hear Glucophage is some good stuff. I’ve been an asthmatic all my life…I wanted to avoid taking any medications unless I have too. Since then (Jan 15) my BGL level have been in a normal range( avoiding alot of sugars in my diet, not eating so much, and some exercise) But today, feeling invulnerable I kinda poured it on, eating a small box of chocolate cookies, a deli sandwich, and I finished off a bottle of wine. all before bedtime. An hour + later I decided to check my BGl level…..It was the highest that I’ve ever known..192mg/ml. That’S approaching the "danger level"  when my body begins to manufacture ketones, which are bad for the kidneys. I begin to feel afraid, perhaps I should have accepted the Doctors offer of Glucophage. But hopefully my BGL will be back to normal in the morning….. I couldn’t resist the box of cookies, and I was hungry late at night, sometimes its hard to take seriously that I have a killer disease, that I really have to avoid lot of sugars, and be careful with my diet.

____ – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "I’m sixty, and I don’t need child-resistant caps on my medicine bottles. They say, "Well, somone with children might come to visit you. "Fuck’ em! They’re on their own. Let’em take their chances. Anyone who visits me is accepting a certain level of risk in the first place." George Carlin

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Greetings all, I am soliciting your advice on what would be a fair price to ask for my Explorer.  It is a 94 XLT with every option available at the time my father bought it.  He passed away a few years ago, and I inherited it from him.  He had put 15,000 miles on it and it currently has about 26,500.  It is in perfect shape (garage kept), except for the gas guage which quit working recently.  My research indicates that I probably need a new float in the gas tank that costs about $200 at the dealers.  I have replaced the firestones with Michelin X Radial LT’s.  Kelly’s blue book and Edmonds put the retail price at between 13,000 and 14,000.  Given all the adverse publicity about SUV’s recently, I do not think I could get that much for it.  So, my question is what would be a reasonable and fair price to offer it for?  Thanks. John

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If you repair the gas gauge and the vehicle is in otherwise "mint" condition, I’d list it at high book value (remember to add some additional for the extremely low mileage) and see what happens. Serious buyers will make an offer if they think the asking price is too high. Figure out what you’ll take as a minimum and stick to your guns.  There are lots of folks looking for good, clean, used SUVs so there shouldn’t be any shortage of interest. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Greetings all, I am soliciting your advice on what would be a fair price to ask for my Explorer.  It is a 94 XLT with every option available at the time my father bought it.  He passed away a few years ago, and I inherited it from him.  He had put 15,000 miles on it and it currently has about 26,500.  It is in perfect shape (garage kept), except for the gas guage which quit working recently.  My research indicates that I probably need a new float in the gas tank that costs about $200 at the dealers.  I have replaced the firestones with Michelin X Radial LT’s.  Kelly’s blue book and Edmonds put the retail price at between 13,000 and 14,000.  Given all the adverse publicity about SUV’s recently, I do not think I could get that much for it.  So, my question is what would be a reasonable and fair price to offer it for?  Thanks. John

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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My parents constantly dog-sit for my brothers 3.5 year old German Shepherd. He used to be given milk as a treat but my brother received some advice saying that it was bad for the dog.  Can someone please tell me whether this is true or not ? Thanks. Mike

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My parents constantly dog-sit for my brothers 3.5 year old German Shepherd. He used to be given milk as a treat but my brother received some advice saying that it was bad for the dog.  Can someone please tell me whether this is true or not ? Thanks. Mike

Many Dogs ,and cats for that matter,are lactose intolerant,just like people.They cannot digest the high fat content in milk and other dairy products. Hope this helps, Rachel

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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| | I mistakenly responded to Bob about his wolf-hybrid question.  I thought he was a | halfway educated person *thinking* about getting a hybrid. That’s how I read the post. | It turns out that he’s | one of the loons who actually breeds them. Why am I not surprised? | His defense?  Well, wolves breed in the | wild with dogs anyway, so why shouldn’t he? Oh. My. doG. Geez, Louise, here we go again… /andrea & Max — Andrea Dec                          (Clever stuff under consideration) Hewlett-Packard Company             but those I do have are not supported                                     by HP.                            

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THE ONLY place where I could possibly see the intentional creation of wolf hybrids would be if there were two wolves left in the entire world and if they didn’t breed to dogs, there wouldn’t be any wolf left in the world.  A species of horse was saved by this same method, but trust me, there are plenty of wolves (though not enough) to keep the population going, so there is no need according to my standards, for the creation of wolf hybrids.   Just my thought, Emily

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For a first time owner, DO NOT GET A WOLF HYBRID!  In fact, don’t get one anyways.  On a 1/2 acre plot, there is no where near enough room for the mix you’re talking about.  What about if you get married anytime within this dog’s lifetime?  That’s 10 to 12 years, you know.  Danes are only about 8 at the most, but still, expect the worst (sorry for a lack of better way to say it).  This is NOT a good idea for anyone.  You like big, smoothcoated dogs?  Try a purebred dane (which, BTW needs a lot of exercise) or a labrador.  A shepherd’s good, just do your research. There are lots of purebred dogs that are about the same as a hybrid, just with better backgrounds if you do your research.  My thoughts, Emily Carroll

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Certain groups, such as the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), and People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), have used misinformation in their misdirected attempts to ban wolf hybrids (the first step in massive breed-specific legislation).  Since these animals are an easy target because of deep-seated "big bad wolf" myths, they are a relatively easy first step.

While the aim of PETA might be to end domestication of dogs, wolf hybrids are disliked by most respectible organizations (which PETA is NOT) who are VERY concerned about preserving the WOLF. These organizations (mostly environmental & even Wolf preservation specific) strongly believe in preserving the wolf’s environment, teaching people about the wolves (to dispell the "big bad wolf" myth) and preserving the species.  It’s THIS species preservation that leads many (including myself) to DISLIKE the creation of wolf hybrids.  Crossing wolves with dogs leads to the dilution of the wolf species, especially if these hybrids are loose. I mistakenly responded to Bob about his wolf-hybrid question.  I thought he was a halfway educated person *thinking* about getting a hybrid.  It turns out that he’s one of the loons who actually breeds them.  His defense?  Well, wolves breed in the wild with dogs anyway, so why shouldn’t he?  Well, since drug dealers in the cities carry AK-47s, why shouldn’t I carry one, too?  That’s the spirit!  Hop on the bandwagon of loonacy. MacDuff

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writes: For a first time owner, DO NOT GET A WOLF HYBRID!  In fact, don’t get one anyways.  On a 1/2 acre plot, there is no where near enough room for the mix you’re talking about.  What about if you get married anytime within this dog’s lifetime?  That’s 10 to 12 years, you know.  Danes are only about 8 at the most, but still, expect the worst (sorry for a lack of better way to say it).  This is NOT a good idea for anyone.  You like big, smoothcoated dogs?  Try a purebred dane (which, BTW needs a lot of exercise) or a labrador.  A shepherd’s good, just do your research. There are lots of purebred dogs that are about the same as a hybrid, just with better backgrounds if you do your research.  My thoughts,

I’ll agree with that.Wolf-hybrids are a piece of work for the experinced to maintain and should not be the pet of a novice dog owner. Leave the Wolf in the wild where it belongs. People have enough difficulty with domestic dog without having to mix wolf into it. A foolish idea mixing dog and wolf. Bob Maida Dog Training/Problem Counseling since 1969 Manassas,Va

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Blake, My veterinarian informs me that there is a distinct problem with wolf hybrids that many people are not aware of. Wolf hybrids cannot be made safe from Rabies – the shots do not take. A wold hybrid could be a serious public health risk! Also, dogs have been bred for centuries to be better pets than wolves. Why go backwards? Have any health tests been done on the wolf (or dog) half of this mix? How many generations? Wolves get all the same health problems. I am still haunted by the sight of a wolf hybrid in a kennel, thin as a rail because she had severe hip dysplasia and was more comfortable that way. I advise against it. Carol and the Carwyn Silkys – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

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Unfortunately, your vet has not told you the truth.  As a person very involved in the wolf/wolf hybrid rabies issue, I can assure you that the rabies vaccine is just as effective on wolves and wolf hybrids as it is on dogs.  This has become a political, rather than biological issue. The USDA has recently been advised by leading scientists that wolves and hybrids can be, and have for years, been protected by the currently used vaccine. Certain groups, such as the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), and People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), have used misinformation in their misdirected attempts to ban wolf hybrids (the first step in massive breed-specific legislation).  Since these animals are an easy target because of deep-seated "big bad wolf" myths, they are a relatively easy first step. Please don’t help to spread this myth.  Your dog may be next on the hit-list. And by the way, wolves and hybrids are no more susceptible to any disorders than any other canine.                 –Frank  Blake,    My veterinarian informs me that there is a distinct problem with wolf  hybrids that many people are not aware of. Wolf hybrids cannot be made  safe from Rabies – the shots do not take. A wold hybrid could be a  serious public health risk!    Also, dogs have been bred for centuries to be better pets than wolves.  Why go backwards? Have any health tests been done on the wolf (or dog)  half of this mix? How many generations? Wolves get all the same health  problems. I am still haunted by the sight of a wolf hybrid in a  kennel, thin as a rail because she had severe hip dysplasia and was  more comfortable that way.     I advise against it.    Carol and the Carwyn Silkys      HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge  fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane.  puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big  dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks  for the advice.    Blake    

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: HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge : fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. : puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big : dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks : for the advice.

Why would you want a Wolf hybrid anyway?  Do you like the idea of a wolf? I, for one, happen to LOVE wolves.  I love them so much that I support groups who want to BAN hybrids.  Hybrids DESTROY wolves as invariably they re-enter the wild and interbreed with the pure wolf. If you have ANY love at all for wolves, DO NOT GET WOLF-HYBRIDS! MacDuff

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HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

First of all, there is no way you can have a huge fenced in yard if your entire property is only 1/2 an acre.  Secondly, don’t get a wolf hybrid.   There is a wolf hybrid (wolf/malumute)  down the street and they have lots of typical wolf hybrid problems with him. He is sweet,  but is very difficult to handle,  needs an amazing amount of exercies and has the constant need to roam. They have already given him away to one experienced dog owner, but that person returned him after about 3 months saying that this dog shouldn’t be in an urban environment at all. If you want a fairly big dog, stick to a breed that can handle a yard the size of yours.  I’d suggest a  Golden Retriever or Lab.  Are you planning to always be single? If so, fine.  If not, then keep in mind that dogs live 10-15 years and you probably will have kids by then so you’ll want a breed good with children.  Lastly, if you work full time please keep in mind that puppies need tons of attention and time – you may want to get a full grown dog instead.  Also, keep in mind that most dogs (and puppies) don’t do well being left outside all day. Instead, it’s best to keep the dog inside and go home during lunch to let the dog out and play with it.  (If you work out of the house, then great.) -Susan

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: HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge : fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. : puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big : dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks : for the advice. : Blake     I’d reconsider if I were you. Wolf Hybrids take a very dedicated special sort of owner ,an owner who can learn that there is a very fine line of distinction between *tame* and *domesticated*.                                            B.

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HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Whatever dog you get, bear in mind that you’re going to have to provide at least a minimum standard of care. You might find an adult who already has shots and is trained. A puppy will need innoculations, equipment, and lots of training. Pups can also be destructive. Bear in mind that your pup is very likely to break, chew, or otherwise wreck at least a few things while growing up. How about setting up a reward for yourself? Plan to get a dog to celebrate your new job, once you get it.

I second this view.  Also, try your local shelter… give a homeless older dog a home and you will both be better for it.

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

one word : pug

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

 There are many small and toy dogs that would be able to adjust ok to life in a mobile home. You could choose anything from a Yorkie to a Chihuahua, Lasa Apso to a miniature daschund, or any combination.  Whatever dog you get, bear in mind that you’re going to have to provide at least a minimum standard of care. You might find an adult who already has shots and is trained. A puppy will need innoculations, equipment, and lots of training. Pups can also be destructive. Bear in mind that your pup is very likely to break, chew, or otherwise wreck at least a few things while growing up.  How about setting up a reward for yourself? Plan to get a dog to celebrate your new job, once you get it.

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated.

I’d suggest finding a job before getting a dog.  You really don’t want to face the possible prospect of a surprise vet bill or the like if your income is shaky…. — Mark Shaw (and Maggie)   PGP public key at ftp.netcom.com:/pub/ms/mshaw "No animal should ever jump up on the dining room furniture unless absolutely certain that he can hold his own in the conversation."    -Fran Lebowitz

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Keep listening to music and start playing along with it.  The more you do this you will start to recognize patterns (chord progressions) within a song.  Also, analyze riffs that you have learned.  You will discover that the notes the bass player uses within a phrase correspond with the chord a guitarist or keyboard player is playing. An example of this would if a guitarist is playing a Am7 chord, the bassplayer would play a phrase that would probably consist of the Root (A), the 5th (E), the minor 7th (G), and the octave (A). In addition, listen to the rhythm the drummer is playing.  That will determine where to place the notes you play. This is not an easy skill to develope, but it is not impossible.  It just takes time and much repetition before you start to realize the patterns bass players use when composing a bassline.  It has taken me 3 years to learn how to recognize notes and I still find it difficult to develope a bass line that doesn’t busy. Lastly, watch other bassist play and copy what they are doing.  It’s what I do. Joe Shelton

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Learn to read music first and your ear will develop over time. It definately dosen’t come in just 5 short months.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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Since you seem to be working on your theory, My advice to you would be to play to records. I’ve got a small practice amp with a headphone jack split between the amp and stereo. It’s great for learning songs. Learn your scales, then pick up some CDs with what you think are some challenging bass lines (start with simpler stuff, then work your way up) and try to figure them out. It’ll do wonders for your ear (unlike tab, which is fine for learning but doesn’t do much for ear development). It never hurts to know some covers for when you start jamming, anyway. Muttley – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hello Everyone, I am new to the bass. I’ve been playing for 5 months now. Can anyone offer any advice, I’ve been using books that come with accompanying CDs. I really would like to become proficient in both reading music and playing by ear. However, though I am really learning to read well, my ear training efforts need some organization. Can anyone offer some advice. Thank You

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I f it were me,I would go for the MM Stingray as it is more or less a collectors item(and sound good)The Fender will be there next year. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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Shit ,Stevie’s #1 is downright pretty next to Rory Gallagers Strat.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…            CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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I don’t think you will go wrong with either one.  Both are really good basses. One thing you might want to consider is that the MusicMan is going to be quite a bit heavier.  If you are going to be playing out alot that might get old after a while.  It wouldn’t bother me but I know a guy who plays 3 or 4 nights a week and it kills his shoulder to play it very often. Don’t be overly impressed by lots of controls.  Play it and see if you can find sounds you like.  The beat up condition can be seen as a sign of character. (It could also mean it was abused.)  Look at the guitar Stevie Ray Vaughn called "Number 1".  It was missing more of the finish than it had left. Personally I like a nice clean looking instrument but to each his/her own. There is some minor tonal differences that the finish will make but I would rather have the wood protected from moisture fluctuation. Play them both and see which sound better to you.  That’s the only way…             CDS "God, Shmod!  I want my monkey man!"  Bart Simpson "Why are we here?  Because we’re here; roll the bones!"  Rush (aka The Greatest Rock an

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Being a player for some 16 years I have tried just about every bass in the world. I started out on a ‘74 Fender Jazz Bass and then ventured out and bought a Alembic then a Smith Burner 5-string then a spector then a Ibenez and so on. Then one day I was in a music store and I was looking for something new, boy was I suprised what I bought. I bought a 1972 sunburst Fender Jazz Bazz. To me they are the best sounding and durable bass on the market. I even use a 1997 Amer.Std Jazz for going out on the road (totally stock except for a badass bridge and a hipshot that I put on myself). I have a $2600.00 ZON dust collector that does not have half the balls of a JAZZ. My second Choice would be a Musicman Stingray (so your on the right ytrack)                                    Greg PS. Stanley Clark uses a four string so should you. If your into slapping and popping and funking it up, Nothing slaps better then a 4-string. Let me know what you decied – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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The only advice I would give is to buy a five if you are in anyway interested and don’t even look at four string basses.  If you were to buy the four-string mentioned, you’d probably end up buying a five string soon after anyway.  Hardly good economy eh! Happy hunting – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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: I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers : and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was : wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one : is better, etc? : First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know : a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are : complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck : They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good : thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. There are plenty of good quality 5 string basses out there, and IMHO Fender is one of them.  But you might a better deal than that at: http://www.musiciansfriend.com If the sales clerks were rude and/or unhelpful, I’d mention it to the manager.  You’re a customer after all, and they depend on your patronage for their business.  If the manager knows you had a problem, (s)he just might wait on you him/herself. : Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was : made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t : played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There : are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 : controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who : is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a : collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to : go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: : it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. : Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. : Thanx, any input is appreciated. : ~Leanne~ And that’s the way it is, Liz, Skip "El Fumador" Skip Elliott Bowman, Music & Travel replace "spamisbad" to "skipster" to reply "You can’t have everything.  Where would you put it?" Steven Wright

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Hey, I am looking for my first REAL bass, but I don’t know much about makers and stuff.  I’m looking at two different ones right now, and I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on pros, cons, which one is better, etc? First of all, a Fender Standard 5 string, made in the USA.  I don’t know a whole lot about it, because those salespeople at Long & McQuade are complete asses, but it plays nice, and I like the big thick neck They’re trying to sell it for $980 cdn w/ hardshell case.  The good thing is it’s a five string, which was sort of what I was looking for. Second, one I just saw today, a MusicMan Stingray, which I think was made in 1976 or 73 (I’m not sure, I forgot what he said).  I haven’t played it yet, but it has active pickups and LOTS of controls.  There are two double (?) pickups, that are really huge, and there are 3 controls with a switch beside each one.  The guy who was selling it (who is also a friend of mine) said they don’t make ‘em any more, and it’s a collectors item.  The price is $750 cdn w/ hardshell case.  I’m going to go try it out tomorrow, but any input would be great.  The downsides: it’s not a 5-string, and it’s pretty beat up. Sorry for my crappy explanation of all the gadgets, I’m new at this. Thanx, any input is appreciated. ~Leanne~

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Well, my tastes are pretty similar to yours. Lemme run down my rig. Probably way north of what you’re looking for price wise, but I’ll run it down any way. Prices are in USD. 2003 Fender Highway 1 Precision Bass (~$630)         An excellent value. The low end of the Fender American made products, but         ome of them are quite good. Lots of variance between instruments, so play         several to find a good one. You could also look at a Mexican fender,         which typically run about $300-$400. I’ve found Fender basses to be an         excellent all-round basses that I can make work for just about anything.         I prefer the P to the Jazz as I have fairly thick fingers that make a         J neck feel cramped, but that’s very much a preference things.         Equipped With:                 Bad Ass II Bridge – ~$50-65. Direct replacement for the stock bridge,                 and much more solid. More bass/thump, more sustain, and it’s much easier                 to restring than the stock bridge.                 Thomastik-Infeld Jazz Flats strings – Flatwound strings that sound nice                 and bright (by flatwound standards). I swear by these strings. Last                 forever, great sound with enough treble for slap playing, and the                 smooth, non-fingertip-destroying slickness of flats. 1994 SWR 350 Amp head ($400 used) – 350w amp, tube preamp, transistor         poweramp. Super sounding amp, very natural. I also play guitar and         keyboards through this head with good results. Easy to use EQ that can         easily dial in anything from deep reggae sounds, to pluky sounds ala         Geddy Lee, to trebly "modern" slap tone. Avatar Speakers B212 cabinet ($320 inc. shipping from http://www.avatarspeakers.com)         Killer cab that’s the perfect compliment to the SWR 350. Super well made,         features 2 Emenence Delta 12" speakers, an adjustable  horn, and porting         to reenforce the low stuff.

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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

Someone may argue this, but I don’t think Ibanez is a good match for that kind of music. It’s really hard to recommend with so many choices out there today. Some of the Fenders are still decent.  Corts, Fernandez, Peavy, Dean, Spector, Warwick… Many companies capable of making a good rock bass.  What’s available to you, in your price range, that you like the look and feel of (besides ibanez )  Yamaha?  They can sound pretty good. —    O< "Hey, who’s da’ U-boat Captain?" /()    ^^                                                      Slidell, LA

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the

SNIP an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.)

Very good musical tastes. You could have added Deep Purple though. JP – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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It depends on your price range. There’s alot of great stuff out, for not alot of cash. Since you’re in canada, there’s a great music store in Watertown, NY. I was there over christmas, I bought a very nice Schecter C-5 new for cheap. they do have a web site. www.blackrivermusic.com   It’s about 3 hours from you, if I remember correct. went to the Falls on my honeymoon, 16 years ago. Later

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It’s been 30 years since I picked up a Bass and I am about to take the plunge and get back into it. I need advice from the group to point me in a direction. When I gave it up in the early 70’s I had a Fender Jass Bass and Traynor Head and Cabinet. My plan is to start with a with a 4 string bass and practice amp to get the rust out and then see what happens. I’ve searched the net and popped into a local music store but have no idea what to start back up with. I was impressed with an Ibanez SR900 Guitar but have no idea what to pick up for in an amp let alone accessories.  I guess it would help to know my music interests! Actually anything except country but primarily classic rock from 60’s, 70’s, 80’s and some 90’s and current stuff (Rush, Yes, Zepplin, Alman Bros., Clapton, Tragically Hip, Gabriel, Who, Aerosmith, Stones, REM, Bela Fleck, Crimson etc.) I would appreciate any help the group can offer. Dave L. Niagara Canada

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My parents constantly dog-sit for my brothers 3.5 year old German Shepherd. He used to be given milk as a treat but my brother received some advice saying that it was bad for the dog.  Can someone please tell me whether this is true or not ? Thanks. Mike

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My parents constantly dog-sit for my brothers 3.5 year old German Shepherd. He used to be given milk as a treat but my brother received some advice saying that it was bad for the dog.  Can someone please tell me whether this is true or not ? Thanks. Mike

Many Dogs ,and cats for that matter,are lactose intolerant,just like people.They cannot digest the high fat content in milk and other dairy products. Hope this helps, Rachel

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer?

ever see an old blues guy rocking his foot on a hollow wooden box?

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I’ve been having that same problem lately. …Mostly, it works out okay,

but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging.

Have you heard Will Lee do ‘Black Coffee’ on Janis Siegel’s version?  Very funky/percussive!  Of course, he also had Anton Fig & Hiram Bullock playing along.  But you might get an idea for your own version.  I think the album was ‘At Home’ from 86-87. Jim

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sure does, but it’s a good exercise, too. Times I’ve played without a drummer, I find myself needing to groove a lot more. I have to pay a lot more attention to when a note ends, since the end of a note may be the only thing spelling out the next beat to the audience. I often do the percussive muting thing, where instead of just touching the string to mute it, I’ll smack them all, creating a downbeat. Or if I am playing a note on the next beat, I might cut the current note a little short so the space between this beat and the next makes the rhythm jump out a bit more. And there’s no room for sloppy timing, either. You can’t hide behind the thump of a kick drum. So, while it’s a stretch, it’s a productive stretch.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

Sounds to me like you’ve got yourself a Bluegrass line up. Check out some stuff by a band called Hayseed Dixie, and see how they arrange Rock standards to a bluegrass stylee, sans drums. Greg

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You could slap that song. People don’t understand that slap can be as minimal and laid back as any other technique. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I’ve been having that same problem lately. We’ve got a vocalist, guitar, drums and bass. New band and we’ve been rehearsing once a week. First gig is 8 Oct. Drummer had to go back to Chicago for the summer to take care of some major committments. Occasionally we have a substitute drummer, but most of the time, I’m the entire rhythm section and it’s a bit taxing. We do standards, samba/bossa nova, jazzy blues and a few hard rockers. Mostly, it works out okay, but it gets a little dicey on the very slow, jazzy blues when the guitarist is weaving a melody line around the vocalist. "Stormy Monday" and "Black Coffee" are particularly challenging. I just do the duck thing, where you look calm on the surface, but paddle like hell under the water. I have to admit to counting in my head and trying to look like I’ve got it covered. For all the shots we take at drummers, it’s good to have them around. Good luck, Neal — Neal Pollack                            PressPlay Computer Consultants "A still tongue fills a wise head." –Blind Jim Brewer

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Im have once in a while found myself having to play wihout a drummer, in fact it happened (to my surprise) on my very first gig as a 14 year old!  However, it was far from Bon Jovi, the other two were accordion and a guitat, both about four times my age (at least I tought so at the time!) Anyway, my advice is that you involve your body in keeping the beat going, it makes it much eaiser to keep the groove going. Also, keep it as simple as possible do not panic if nothing happens at every 16. note. Less is more. And if you ask me, you’d be crazy if you start slapping to compensate for the lack of drums. Good luck and have fun! John Eriksen

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

I used to be in a similar band.  I’m a drummer first, bassist second, though many have told me I’ve caught up.  :-) One thing I’d do in that situation that I do less when I’m playing with a drummer is to pepper your playing hitting the octave of the root note.  You can use the root as the bass drum, and the octave as a snare if you will…   That’s just one technique–but grooving is more a matter of setting down the groove, and hoping your bandmates are actively listening to you for that direction.  Talk about it with em…. —   /"  ASCII Ribbon Campaign                | Todd H   /                                       | http://www.toddh.net/    X   Promoting good netiquette            | http://triplethreatband.com/   /  http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/     | "4 lines suffice."

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Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Make sure at least one of the other instruments is playing rhythm along with you at any time. Joe S.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Slap bass is rythmic as well as percussive, but i can hardly imagine slappin’ through "Let it be" e.g…. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Hire a Japanese drummer-inna-box? Bon Jovi with rhythm mandolin. The mind boggles. There are some times you really have to say no. — Clive

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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Sure… when there’s no percussion, "think" them in your head. I do it all the time when practicing or playing. In a lot of situations I am the timekeeper, especially in jazz so knowing where one is (or used to be ;^) is key ;^) I guess you could practice with a metronome, working with the click on different beats (just the one, two and four, etc.) to get implied timing under your belt. Then for grins you could work on having it set to just the three or something like that to check your time locking ability. I’ve never practiced with a metronome, I’ve been lucky enough to be blessed with a great internal playback facility :^D One of the things that first attracted me to slap way back when was the ability to mimic a drum kit. You could work on the kick drum/snare combo (thump/pop) and once you get that under your belt it’s very easy to "hear" it even when you aren’t physically doing it. The only limits are your imagination. Listen to drummers if you aren’t already doing that/ It just takes practice. Brad – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Anyone have any thoughts or advice on grooving without a drummer? I have a gig coming up with the trio I’m in and were doing everything from the Beatles to Bonjovi to the Eagles. Acoustic guitar, mandolin and bass. Sometimes it sucks being the entire bottom end.

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| | I mistakenly responded to Bob about his wolf-hybrid question.  I thought he was a | halfway educated person *thinking* about getting a hybrid. That’s how I read the post. | It turns out that he’s | one of the loons who actually breeds them. Why am I not surprised? | His defense?  Well, wolves breed in the | wild with dogs anyway, so why shouldn’t he? Oh. My. doG. Geez, Louise, here we go again… /andrea & Max — Andrea Dec                          (Clever stuff under consideration) Hewlett-Packard Company             but those I do have are not supported                                     by HP.                            

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THE ONLY place where I could possibly see the intentional creation of wolf hybrids would be if there were two wolves left in the entire world and if they didn’t breed to dogs, there wouldn’t be any wolf left in the world.  A species of horse was saved by this same method, but trust me, there are plenty of wolves (though not enough) to keep the population going, so there is no need according to my standards, for the creation of wolf hybrids.   Just my thought, Emily

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For a first time owner, DO NOT GET A WOLF HYBRID!  In fact, don’t get one anyways.  On a 1/2 acre plot, there is no where near enough room for the mix you’re talking about.  What about if you get married anytime within this dog’s lifetime?  That’s 10 to 12 years, you know.  Danes are only about 8 at the most, but still, expect the worst (sorry for a lack of better way to say it).  This is NOT a good idea for anyone.  You like big, smoothcoated dogs?  Try a purebred dane (which, BTW needs a lot of exercise) or a labrador.  A shepherd’s good, just do your research. There are lots of purebred dogs that are about the same as a hybrid, just with better backgrounds if you do your research.  My thoughts, Emily Carroll

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Certain groups, such as the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), and People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), have used misinformation in their misdirected attempts to ban wolf hybrids (the first step in massive breed-specific legislation).  Since these animals are an easy target because of deep-seated "big bad wolf" myths, they are a relatively easy first step.

While the aim of PETA might be to end domestication of dogs, wolf hybrids are disliked by most respectible organizations (which PETA is NOT) who are VERY concerned about preserving the WOLF. These organizations (mostly environmental & even Wolf preservation specific) strongly believe in preserving the wolf’s environment, teaching people about the wolves (to dispell the "big bad wolf" myth) and preserving the species.  It’s THIS species preservation that leads many (including myself) to DISLIKE the creation of wolf hybrids.  Crossing wolves with dogs leads to the dilution of the wolf species, especially if these hybrids are loose. I mistakenly responded to Bob about his wolf-hybrid question.  I thought he was a halfway educated person *thinking* about getting a hybrid.  It turns out that he’s one of the loons who actually breeds them.  His defense?  Well, wolves breed in the wild with dogs anyway, so why shouldn’t he?  Well, since drug dealers in the cities carry AK-47s, why shouldn’t I carry one, too?  That’s the spirit!  Hop on the bandwagon of loonacy. MacDuff

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writes: For a first time owner, DO NOT GET A WOLF HYBRID!  In fact, don’t get one anyways.  On a 1/2 acre plot, there is no where near enough room for the mix you’re talking about.  What about if you get married anytime within this dog’s lifetime?  That’s 10 to 12 years, you know.  Danes are only about 8 at the most, but still, expect the worst (sorry for a lack of better way to say it).  This is NOT a good idea for anyone.  You like big, smoothcoated dogs?  Try a purebred dane (which, BTW needs a lot of exercise) or a labrador.  A shepherd’s good, just do your research. There are lots of purebred dogs that are about the same as a hybrid, just with better backgrounds if you do your research.  My thoughts,

I’ll agree with that.Wolf-hybrids are a piece of work for the experinced to maintain and should not be the pet of a novice dog owner. Leave the Wolf in the wild where it belongs. People have enough difficulty with domestic dog without having to mix wolf into it. A foolish idea mixing dog and wolf. Bob Maida Dog Training/Problem Counseling since 1969 Manassas,Va

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Blake, My veterinarian informs me that there is a distinct problem with wolf hybrids that many people are not aware of. Wolf hybrids cannot be made safe from Rabies – the shots do not take. A wold hybrid could be a serious public health risk! Also, dogs have been bred for centuries to be better pets than wolves. Why go backwards? Have any health tests been done on the wolf (or dog) half of this mix? How many generations? Wolves get all the same health problems. I am still haunted by the sight of a wolf hybrid in a kennel, thin as a rail because she had severe hip dysplasia and was more comfortable that way. I advise against it. Carol and the Carwyn Silkys – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

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Unfortunately, your vet has not told you the truth.  As a person very involved in the wolf/wolf hybrid rabies issue, I can assure you that the rabies vaccine is just as effective on wolves and wolf hybrids as it is on dogs.  This has become a political, rather than biological issue. The USDA has recently been advised by leading scientists that wolves and hybrids can be, and have for years, been protected by the currently used vaccine. Certain groups, such as the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS), and People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA), have used misinformation in their misdirected attempts to ban wolf hybrids (the first step in massive breed-specific legislation).  Since these animals are an easy target because of deep-seated "big bad wolf" myths, they are a relatively easy first step. Please don’t help to spread this myth.  Your dog may be next on the hit-list. And by the way, wolves and hybrids are no more susceptible to any disorders than any other canine.                 –Frank  Blake,    My veterinarian informs me that there is a distinct problem with wolf  hybrids that many people are not aware of. Wolf hybrids cannot be made  safe from Rabies – the shots do not take. A wold hybrid could be a  serious public health risk!    Also, dogs have been bred for centuries to be better pets than wolves.  Why go backwards? Have any health tests been done on the wolf (or dog)  half of this mix? How many generations? Wolves get all the same health  problems. I am still haunted by the sight of a wolf hybrid in a  kennel, thin as a rail because she had severe hip dysplasia and was  more comfortable that way.     I advise against it.    Carol and the Carwyn Silkys      HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge  fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane.  puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big  dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks  for the advice.    Blake    

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: HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge : fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. : puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big : dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks : for the advice.

Why would you want a Wolf hybrid anyway?  Do you like the idea of a wolf? I, for one, happen to LOVE wolves.  I love them so much that I support groups who want to BAN hybrids.  Hybrids DESTROY wolves as invariably they re-enter the wild and interbreed with the pure wolf. If you have ANY love at all for wolves, DO NOT GET WOLF-HYBRIDS! MacDuff

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HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

First of all, there is no way you can have a huge fenced in yard if your entire property is only 1/2 an acre.  Secondly, don’t get a wolf hybrid.   There is a wolf hybrid (wolf/malumute)  down the street and they have lots of typical wolf hybrid problems with him. He is sweet,  but is very difficult to handle,  needs an amazing amount of exercies and has the constant need to roam. They have already given him away to one experienced dog owner, but that person returned him after about 3 months saying that this dog shouldn’t be in an urban environment at all. If you want a fairly big dog, stick to a breed that can handle a yard the size of yours.  I’d suggest a  Golden Retriever or Lab.  Are you planning to always be single? If so, fine.  If not, then keep in mind that dogs live 10-15 years and you probably will have kids by then so you’ll want a breed good with children.  Lastly, if you work full time please keep in mind that puppies need tons of attention and time – you may want to get a full grown dog instead.  Also, keep in mind that most dogs (and puppies) don’t do well being left outside all day. Instead, it’s best to keep the dog inside and go home during lunch to let the dog out and play with it.  (If you work out of the house, then great.) -Susan

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: HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge : fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. : puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big : dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks : for the advice. : Blake     I’d reconsider if I were you. Wolf Hybrids take a very dedicated special sort of owner ,an owner who can learn that there is a very fine line of distinction between *tame* and *domesticated*.                                            B.

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HI all.  I need some advice.  I live on a half acre lot with a huge fenced back yard.  I am thinking of buying a hybrid wolf-great dane. puppy.  Has anyone seen a mix a like this.  It looks like a fun big dog to have.  I am single, so little kids wont be a problem.  thanks for the advice. Blake

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try Bonneville Dam, 541-374-8442, they have a bunch of large sturgeon in holding tanks there.  ask for Eric, or someone who knows about sturgeon. -laurie I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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I am in the process of putting together a website on sturgeon- fishing, conservation, aquaculture, aquaria,etc, and I am looking for info relating to sturgeon. Advice, pics, locations to purchase, personal experiences, websites, experts and so on. Advice and referrals are greatly appreciated. Thanx, Don Larson

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Whatever dog you get, bear in mind that you’re going to have to provide at least a minimum standard of care. You might find an adult who already has shots and is trained. A puppy will need innoculations, equipment, and lots of training. Pups can also be destructive. Bear in mind that your pup is very likely to break, chew, or otherwise wreck at least a few things while growing up. How about setting up a reward for yourself? Plan to get a dog to celebrate your new job, once you get it.

I second this view.  Also, try your local shelter… give a homeless older dog a home and you will both be better for it.

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

one word : pug

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I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

 There are many small and toy dogs that would be able to adjust ok to life in a mobile home. You could choose anything from a Yorkie to a Chihuahua, Lasa Apso to a miniature daschund, or any combination.  Whatever dog you get, bear in mind that you’re going to have to provide at least a minimum standard of care. You might find an adult who already has shots and is trained. A puppy will need innoculations, equipment, and lots of training. Pups can also be destructive. Bear in mind that your pup is very likely to break, chew, or otherwise wreck at least a few things while growing up.  How about setting up a reward for yourself? Plan to get a dog to celebrate your new job, once you get it.

Response:

I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated. Thanks, Noel

Response:

I would like to get a dog before to much longer but need some help. I live in moble home and don’t have that much room. I also do not have a fenced in yard. Poddles are out and I don’t want a cat. I’m also tring to find a job so that’s anohter factor. Any advice would be appericated.

I’d suggest finding a job before getting a dog.  You really don’t want to face the possible prospect of a surprise vet bill or the like if your income is shaky…. — Mark Shaw (and Maggie)   PGP public key at ftp.netcom.com:/pub/ms/mshaw "No animal should ever jump up on the dining room furniture unless absolutely certain that he can hold his own in the conversation."    -Fran Lebowitz

Response:

Sorry, Jack, but you sound a little grandiose here. I think it’s time for you to sit back and reassess where you are at, then get on the phone to your doctor for a med adjustment. Catherine made an excellent contribution to your original message, and I dare say your urgent point is nonexistent.

))Your critique is cutsie.  You made an urgent point light and fluffy, ))preventing others from focusing on the real message. )) )) ))"Love first, then structure." ))"Chemical imbalance is the result, not the cause." ))"Mental illness does not produce the creative artist. Society turmoils the ))creative soul." )) ))

)) ))People are different. )) ))Thank you whomever/whatever for those differences. )) )) Good souls are extremely rare, and suffer isolation. )) ))Ah, but we all probably enter this world with good souls, ))just some lose them along the path and find them again ))somewhere along the way, sometimes at the very end of the ))path.  I believe 99% of people are inherently good given the ))chance.  And, isolation is not necessarily a bad choice ))sometimes. )) ))The answer to life is to find people like you. )) ))Agree, but also think it is also important to have people in ))one’s life who are different to keep perspective and to ))stave off terminal uniqueness. )) ))Then solve the riddle together. )) ))At least two heads are better than…. )) )) ))Some days we are the pigeons, some days we are the statues. ))Some days we are the windshields, some days we are the bugs. ))Some days are chickensoup, some days are chickenshit. )) ))catherine )) )) ))Paint the sky with stars ))So our spirits have to fly. )) Keith Hardwick  

Response:

))Eat me. Your critique is cutsie.  You made an urgent point light and fluffy, preventing others from focusing on the real message. You were saying? ))

))Sorry, Jack, but you sound a little grandiose here. I think it’s time for ))you to sit back ))and reassess where you are at, then get on the phone to your doctor for a ))med adjustment. ))Catherine made an excellent contribution to your original message, and I ))dare say your ))urgent point is nonexistent. Keith Hardwick  

Response:

People are different.  Good souls are extremely rare, and suffer isolation. The answer to life is to find people like you.  Then solve the riddle together.

Response:

Your critique is cutsie.  You made an urgent point light and fluffy, preventing others from focusing on the real message. "Love first, then structure." "Chemical imbalance is the result, not the cause." "Mental illness does not produce the creative artist. Society turmoils the creative soul." – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – People are different. Thank you whomever/whatever for those differences. Good souls are extremely rare, and suffer isolation. Ah, but we all probably enter this world with good souls, just some lose them along the path and find them again somewhere along the way, sometimes at the very end of the path.  I believe 99% of people are inherently good given the chance.  And, isolation is not necessarily a bad choice sometimes. The answer to life is to find people like you. Agree, but also think it is also important to have people in one’s life who are different to keep perspective and to stave off terminal uniqueness. Then solve the riddle together. At least two heads are better than…. Some days we are the pigeons, some days we are the statues. Some days we are the windshields, some days we are the bugs. Some days are chickensoup, some days are chickenshit. catherine Paint the sky with stars So our spirits have to fly.

Response:

Eat me. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry, Jack, but you sound a little grandiose here. I think it’s time for you to sit back and reassess where you are at, then get on the phone to your doctor for a med adjustment. Catherine made an excellent contribution to your original message, and I dare say your urgent point is nonexistent. ))Your critique is cutsie.  You made an urgent point light and fluffy, ))preventing others from focusing on the real message. )) )) ))"Love first, then structure." ))"Chemical imbalance is the result, not the cause." ))"Mental illness does not produce the creative artist. Society turmoils the ))creative soul." )) )) )) ))People are different. )) ))Thank you whomever/whatever for those differences. )) )) Good souls are extremely rare, and suffer isolation. )) ))Ah, but we all probably enter this world with good souls, ))just some lose them along the path and find them again ))somewhere along the way, sometimes at the very end of the ))path.  I believe 99% of people are inherently good given the ))chance.  And, isolation is not necessarily a bad choice ))sometimes. )) ))The answer to life is to find people like you. )) ))Agree, but also think it is also important to have people in ))one’s life who are different to keep perspective and to ))stave off terminal uniqueness. )) ))Then solve the riddle together. )) ))At least two heads are better than…. )) )) ))Some days we are the pigeons, some days we are the statues. ))Some days we are the windshields, some days we are the bugs. ))Some days are chickensoup, some days are chickenshit. )) ))catherine )) )) ))Paint the sky with stars ))So our spirits have to fly. )) Keith Hardwick

Response:

Hello, I am wondering if anyone has any advice for me.  I am planning on taking a tour of the US by my backpack.  I am not nessessarily going into the woods all the time.  I want to wander from city to city via, walking, hitchiking, etc…  Kind of a well prepared hippie thing…? Do you have any ideas as to the type of gear I should bring, other consider- ations.  I may sleep outside, or in a hotel, or the house of a friendly willing stranger.  Etc…

Try not to get arrested for vagrancy!

Response:

Hello, I am wondering if anyone has any advice for me.  I am planning on taking a tour of the US by my backpack.  I am not nessessarily going into the woods all the time.  I want to wander from city to city via, walking, hitchiking, etc…  Kind of a well prepared hippie thing…? Do you have any ideas as to the type of gear I should bring, other consider- ations.  I may sleep outside, or in a hotel, or the house of a friendly willing stranger.  Etc… Any and all feedback will be greatly appreciated. Michael

Response:

Looking for the best snorkling, all inclu. family resort in Carrib. Any Suggestions greatly appr.

Response:

I just read a great article on Belize and it sounds *great* for everything from snorkeling and scuba diving to mountain biking in the jungle. This url is for the CSAA site (which I work with), which is a very credible source, so here’s the article: http://www.csaa.com/via/travelarchive/belize.asp Enjoy! Bridget – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for the best snorkling, all inclu. family resort in Carrib. Any Suggestions greatly appr.

Response:

Hi everyone, Thanks to all who replied to my post ! Unfortunately my friend doesn’t have a computer, so she will be unable to access this news group.  Thanks for the link Howard. I’ll keep in touch, James Duncan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, An acquaintance of mine is has been having some real problems lately. She has Crohn’s/Colitis, and Lupus.  The Crohn’s has flared up recently (i’m not aware to what extent), and she is quite depressed.  Does anyone have any suggestions or encouraging words that I can pass along to her ?  I also told her that I would look to see if there are any support groups in the Lanark Ontario area.  Is anyone aware of any such group in this area ?  I’m going to contact the Crohn’s and Colitis Foundation of Canada as well. Thanks for your help, James Duncan

Response:

James This is the site map for the CCFC. http://www.ccfc.ca/site.html Check under ‘Chapters’ or ‘Regional Offices’ for more information. Howard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, An acquaintance of mine is has been having some real problems lately. She has Crohn’s/Colitis, and Lupus.  The Crohn’s has flared up recently (i’m not aware to what extent), and she is quite depressed.  Does anyone have any suggestions or encouraging words that I can pass along to her ?  I also told her that I would look to see if there are any support groups in the Lanark Ontario area.  Is anyone aware of any such group in this area ?  I’m going to contact the Crohn’s and Colitis Foundation of Canada as well. Thanks for your help, James Duncan

Response:

Be there for your friend.  Every day.  On my sickest days, one of the worst things was when no one contacted me and then I really felt alone.  The disease and especially pred makes you depressed. From my own experience: Call her at least every day.  Visit her if that doesn’t make her unconfortable. Go shopping for her, run errands, clean up her place for her, do her laundry, etc.  Someone suggested movies and flowers — that would be great.  Take her to doc appointments — arrange for the doc appointments, too, if that is too overwhelming for her.   Jennifer

Response:

Hi James: Does your friend have access to a computer? We would love to have him/her join us. In the meantime – just try to be understanding but not condescending. . . if he/she needs help keeping the house clean, running errands, making phone calls, etc those would be things I need help with but never ask. Some people find funny movies help to take your mind off of your illness – you might suggest it or better yet – rent some and take them over. Heating pads and warm tea help some as well. Books from the library are nice – as are greeting cards and flowers. Hope that helps. Thanks for being such a caring friend. Rebecca

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, An acquaintance of mine is has been having some real problems lately. She has Crohn’s/Colitis, and Lupus.  The Crohn’s has flared up recently (i’m not aware to what extent), and she is quite depressed.  Does anyone have any suggestions or encouraging words that I can pass along to her ?  I also told her that I would look to see if there are any support groups in the Lanark Ontario area.  Is anyone aware of any such group in this area ?  I’m going to contact the Crohn’s and Colitis Foundation of Canada as well. Thanks for your help, James Duncan

Response:

Hi Folks, An acquaintance of mine is has been having some real problems lately. She has Crohn’s/Colitis, and Lupus.  The Crohn’s has flared up recently (i’m not aware to what extent), and she is quite depressed.  Does anyone have any suggestions or encouraging words that I can pass along to her ?  I also told her that I would look to see if there are any support groups in the Lanark Ontario area.  Is anyone aware of any such group in this area ?  I’m going to contact the Crohn’s and Colitis Foundation of Canada as well. Thanks for your help, James Duncan

Response:

James,     Just be there and support your friend. Tania – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Folks, An acquaintance of mine is has been having some real problems lately. She has Crohn’s/Colitis, and Lupus.  The Crohn’s has flared up recently (i’m not aware to what extent), and she is quite depressed.  Does anyone have any suggestions or encouraging words that I can pass along to her ?  I also told her that I would look to see if there are any support groups in the Lanark Ontario area.  Is anyone aware of any such group in this area ?  I’m going to contact the Crohn’s and Colitis Foundation of Canada as well. Thanks for your help, James Duncan

Response:

Hope you have a good holiday, Gail.  Happy New Year.   Margie

Response:

Angel, After I posted my last response to you, I got to wondering.  Later that night when my fiancee got home from school I asked her which she thought would have been easier on her.  Would it have worked better if I told her right away (like I did) or if I has waited until I had to tell her. BTW, I could have waited quite a while to tell her.  We met each other online and didn’t actually meet face to face until 4 months later. She said she wasn’t quite sure, since it only happened one way.  She was, however, glad that I did tell her when I did.  Not for the reason that it gave her an early out, but so she knew what was coming when she finally did see it in me first hand. Hope this point of view from the other side helps a little. Kaleb

Response:

Angel, You said give you any advice on any topic, actually I am tired of giving advice that no one takes to heart and doesn’t believe anyway but here I go  again hating to pass some one by that might benefit.  My advice is that of a layman on the cause of crohns. You say you have UC, I think it may apply to that also, as they are both so much alike. My theory is that crohns is caused by someone the crohnie knows well and is in a relationship with (friend or family) that happens to be on a stimulant drug, such as amphetamine, diet drug, anti-depressant, marijuana, cocaine, depakote, buspar, seratonin drug, or 1 of many I would not know that has a stimulant as an ingredient.   When that person is on the drug, it can cause a vulnerable person to develop the symptoms of crohns (and

Response:

Regarding the advice to Angel, the post got away from me before completion and it was not meant for the newsgroup as I do not post generally my thoughts anymore. Gail

Response:

This is actually for Angel…try to remember that CD is not a disease that you can hide for very long.  If you hope to have a long-term relationship, it is best to tell him soon.  You need to know if he is going to be supportive, and he really should be told so he can decide if he can or wants to hang in there for the long haul.  As unpredictable as this disease is, and flar-ups can happen at any time, I wouldn’t wait too long in telling him.  As Catharinge said, if he is going to be scared off by this, you are better off without him and you need to know this sooner, rather than later, when you may need to depend on him for something, like a run to the ER or just understanding your urgent need to find a bathroom!  Just my 2 cents worth.   Best of luck in whatever you decide to do. Always,   Margie

Response:

Hi there Angel,  I tell most people when I feel that I can trust them – sometimes though I have to tell someone ‘in an emergency’ when I havn’t known them long but almost everyone has been supportive.  I would tell your boyfriend as soon as possible.  My boyfriend (who is very supportive and makes me do things which I enjoy even if I don’t feel like it because he knows that I will feel better afterwards) says that if someone is going to be scared by something like CD you are better off without them! Good luck if you decide to tell him Catharine * Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping.  Smart is Beautiful

Response:

Merry Christmas, Gail. Howard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Regarding the advice to Angel, the post got away from me before completion and it was not meant for the newsgroup as I do not post generally my thoughts anymore. Gail

Response:

Angel, Tell him as soon as you can.  It’s a part of you now, even though you don’t want it to be.  (we don’t want you to have it either) Be sure to give him as much info as you can, so he can understand that this disease doesn’t change who you are, just how often you have to go to the bathroom.  :o) I’ve had 3 girlfriends in the time I’ve had UC.  The first was with me when I was diagnosed, but it didn’t change how she felt.  Her support was great. The second one wasn’t concerned about my UC, but was terrified about my upcoming liver transplant.  The fact that I had a potentially fatal disease was too much for her. That was my biggest fear, that someone wouldn’t want me because I was broken. My current one (also my fiancee) is the best.  She’s been through most of this with me, including 3 surgeries and a bad flareup.  She’s never even thought twice about being with me. I don’t think any of them would have been as supportive if I had not let them know what was going on with me from the beginning. Good luck, Kaleb – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi!  My name is Angel, and I need some advice.  I’m 17, and was diagnosed in January 99 with uc.  I’m beginning to date this guy, who’s really sweet and caring.  My question is when is the right time to talk to him about my condition, and when that time comes, how to tell him.  I think I probably should tell him soon, because if he doesn’t want to be involved with me because of that, it’s better to find that out in the beginning than in the middle or if I have a flare finding out then that he’ll dump me because of it.  I don’t picture this guy being like that, he cares for me too much to do that.  I don’t know…I need some advice. Give me any advice you feel like…doesn’t even have to be on this topic.  On another note, do any of you have any good mottos that would be good for a class motto?  Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks, Angel

Response:

Hi!  My name is Angel, and I need some advice.  I’m 17, and was diagnosed in January 99 with uc.  I’m beginning to date this guy, who’s really sweet and caring.  My question is when is the right time to talk to him about my condition, and when that time comes, how to tell him.  I think I probably should tell him soon, because if he doesn’t want to be involved with me because of that, it’s better to find that out in the beginning than in the middle or if I have a flare finding out then that he’ll dump me because of it.  I don’t picture this guy being like that, he cares for me too much to do that.  I don’t know…I need some advice. Give me any advice you feel like…doesn’t even have to be on this topic.  On another note, do any of you have any good mottos that would be good for a class motto?  Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks, Angel

Response:

Thanks to those of you who offered your advice. Another question: Do you know of some good web sites with information about CD? I know very little about it. Thanks again, Verna

Response:

Hi! My name is Verna. I have recently become concerned that I have something wrong with my intestinal system, and am now wondering if I have (or am developing) Crohn’s Disease. For about a year I have been suffering from on again off again diarreha. Though inconvienient, it was not really painful. Recently I have begun to experience abdominal pains and bloating. The pain radiates around to my back at times. I was hoping to find a food that was affecting me this way, but perhaps I should discuss CD with my doctor? What is your advice? Thanks, Verna

Verna…what you describe is classial chrons!!!         Please consulted your doc.  They can help. Ralph

Response:

Yes most definatly you should discuss it with your doctor.  You might want to  discuss it with a Gastro speciaist instead of your family doctor.  He would  most likely send you to one any how.  Don’t wait  around till it gets worse.  Let me know how it goes!  Take care, Diana…

Response:

Yes, see a doctor, but not a GP.  Get someone to recommend a Gastronentrologist.  Don’t waste your time and money on a GP.  You may not have CD, but one of the many other GI problems that affect people, but you will find out a lot faster with a Gastronentrologist.

Response:

Yes, pain radiating to the back, I have this also. Abdomen problems are soo complicated, it could be caused by a million different things, but, yes, I would definitely discuss possibility of Crohn’s or some other problem with your doctor. They may diagnose you as "Irritable Bowel" first, but it is still bothering you, just let your doctor know, they will eventually come up with the right diagnoses. Take Care! — Suzette Franck/Tony Sison – Spam filter in use – to reply, replace "nospam" with "happyjoy"

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the BLIIHJ before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

With very few exceptions stand by tickets don’t exist any more.  The longer you wait, the more it will probably cost you. Two things you may want to consider, depending on the price – A Round trip from London to Atlanta and back again may be less expensive then a one way, you then throw out the other half of the ticket.  If purchasing from Atlanta to London it would almost be certain to be less expensive to toss half the ticket, I’m not sure on the London to Atlanta side. The other is the consolidators or bucket shops, they have adverts in all the Sunday Travel sections and may give you a better deal then the airlines will.  If they don’t advertise in the UK there are certainly many of them on the internet.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I came to this area because I look for information on RA for my boyfriend who was diagnosed last year.  Increases in methotrexate (now injecting), pregnisone, and a slew of other medications help some but are of course, of concern because of their side effects. Since I am the computer literate of the two, I look for information.  Can anyone advise me on the best places to find worthwhile information on treatments, nutrition, alternative healing?   Also, I’m happy to hear advice on how I can best be supportive of him, whether emotionally or even physically.  As I know you do, he faces many trying challenges daily.

Response:

 Can anyone advise me on the best places to find worthwhile information on treatments, nutrition, alternative healing?   Also, I’m happy to hear advice on how I can best be supportive of him, whether emotionally or even physically.  As I know you do, he faces many trying challenges daily.

Dear Naturecase, As far as I’m concerned one of the best web sites for RA is hosted by drdoc a generous rheumatologist who contributes regularly to this newsgroup. His address is http://www.aztec.co.za/users/drdoc/ The other is by another contributor to the newsgroup–Walt Hanks His address is   www.byu.edu/~whanks/WaltHP.html Both sites are loaded with great information. As far as support and as a RA person my suggestion is to learn as much as both you and he can about this disease. Emotionally-just being there and hearing him. Validation. Physically-a nice massage now and again would be just dandy. Best of luck,

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the BLIIHJ before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

With very few exceptions stand by tickets don’t exist any more.  The longer you wait, the more it will probably cost you. Two things you may want to consider, depending on the price – A Round trip from London to Atlanta and back again may be less expensive then a one way, you then throw out the other half of the ticket.  If purchasing from Atlanta to London it would almost be certain to be less expensive to toss half the ticket, I’m not sure on the London to Atlanta side. The other is the consolidators or bucket shops, they have adverts in all the Sunday Travel sections and may give you a better deal then the airlines will.  If they don’t advertise in the UK there are certainly many of them on the internet.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the BLIIHJ before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

With very few exceptions stand by tickets don’t exist any more.  The longer you wait, the more it will probably cost you. Two things you may want to consider, depending on the price – A Round trip from London to Atlanta and back again may be less expensive then a one way, you then throw out the other half of the ticket.  If purchasing from Atlanta to London it would almost be certain to be less expensive to toss half the ticket, I’m not sure on the London to Atlanta side. The other is the consolidators or bucket shops, they have adverts in all the Sunday Travel sections and may give you a better deal then the airlines will.  If they don’t advertise in the UK there are certainly many of them on the internet.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I am wanting to travel from London, England to Atlanta, GA, in mid-September.  I was wondering whether anyone had any advice about how I should go about buying a ticket.  Is it true that I will get a good price if I book at the last minute?  And are standby tickets worth it?  I don’t know much about them. Please remove the ESBTRG before replying by email. ***** Posted via the UK Online online newsreader *****  Go to http://www.ukonline.co.uk to find out  about other online services we offer our subscribers.

Response:

I came to this area because I look for information on RA for my boyfriend who was diagnosed last year.  Increases in methotrexate (now injecting), pregnisone, and a slew of other medications help some but are of course, of concern because of their side effects. Since I am the computer literate of the two, I look for information.  Can anyone advise me on the best places to find worthwhile information on treatments, nutrition, alternative healing?   Also, I’m happy to hear advice on how I can best be supportive of him, whether emotionally or even physically.  As I know you do, he faces many trying challenges daily.

Response:

 Can anyone advise me on the best places to find worthwhile information on treatments, nutrition, alternative healing?   Also, I’m happy to hear advice on how I can best be supportive of him, whether emotionally or even physically.  As I know you do, he faces many trying challenges daily.

Dear Naturecase, As far as I’m concerned one of the best web sites for RA is hosted by drdoc a generous rheumatologist who contributes regularly to this newsgroup. His address is http://www.aztec.co.za/users/drdoc/ The other is by another contributor to the newsgroup–Walt Hanks His address is   www.byu.edu/~whanks/WaltHP.html Both sites are loaded with great information. As far as support and as a RA person my suggestion is to learn as much as both you and he can about this disease. Emotionally-just being there and hearing him. Validation. Physically-a nice massage now and again would be just dandy. Best of luck,

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First of all thanks in advance to any that offer help to me. I am brand new to the world of hunting and guns in general. What I am looking for is any advice that can be offered to me. I recently purchased a Remington 870 Express Magnum 12 ga. pump shotgun. What I would like is some information on how to judge what ammunition is best to use on each particular game. Also if anyone can provide a source of definitions for various gun terms would be greatly appreciated.                                                 James

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The Winchester and Remington ammo catalogues should have good ammo selection guides.  Pattern your shotgun with the ammo you choose before your go hunting.

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First of all thanks in advance to any that offer help to me. I am brand new to the world of hunting and guns in general. What I am looking for is any advice that can be offered to me. I recently purchased a Remington 870 Express Magnum 12 ga. pump shotgun. What I would like is some information on how to judge what ammunition is best to use on each particular game. Also if anyone can provide a source of definitions for various gun terms would be greatly appreciated.                                                 James

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The Winchester and Remington ammo catalogues should have good ammo selection guides.  Pattern your shotgun with the ammo you choose before your go hunting.

Response:

First of all thanks in advance to any that offer help to me. I am brand new to the world of hunting and guns in general. What I am looking for is any advice that can be offered to me. I recently purchased a Remington 870 Express Magnum 12 ga. pump shotgun. What I would like is some information on how to judge what ammunition is best to use on each particular game. Also if anyone can provide a source of definitions for various gun terms would be greatly appreciated.                                                 James

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The Winchester and Remington ammo catalogues should have good ammo selection guides.  Pattern your shotgun with the ammo you choose before your go hunting.

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Have you tried your travel agent?  They can usually set you up with the travel plans and give all kinds od info. On the places in the town/city. Or even the hotel you"d be staying can help. GOOD LUCK! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My fiance and I would dearly like to get married in Verona or Florence accompanied by trwo friends. Not a big deal you would have thought, but we can’t find anyone to arrange things. Can anyone who reads this newsgroup point us in the right direction? Any help appreciated.

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My fiance and I would dearly like to get married in Verona or Florence accompanied by trwo friends. Not a big deal you would have thought, but we can’t find anyone to arrange things. Can anyone who reads this newsgroup point us in the right direction? Any help appreciated.

I have links for you on the legal aspects (assuming you’re American) and for one wedding planner in Florence (no endorsement of the services — they just have a good Web site!). http://www.skypoint.com/~vyborney/honeymoon.htm — scroll to the bottom for link lists. Wende

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My fiance and I would dearly like to get married in Verona or Florence accompanied by trwo friends. Not a big deal you would have thought, but we can’t find anyone to arrange things. Can anyone who reads this newsgroup point us in the right direction? Any help appreciated.

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My fiance and I would dearly like to get married in Verona or Florence accompanied by trwo friends. Not a big deal you would have thought, but we can’t find anyone to arrange things. Can anyone who reads this newsgroup point us in the right direction? Any help appreciated.

Geez, I just read an article *somewhere* about a couple who were married at a gorgeous "villa" hotel in Florence.  I think it might’ve been in the Sunday paper — try looking at sfgate.com. More generally, you probably need an English-speaking Italian wedding coordinator, or a hotel that offers full-service wedding packages.  Try local travel agents for referrals. Holly

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Well, based upon my assumption that you are in the United States and Italy is East of the USA… I would point you East. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My fiance and I would dearly like to get married in Verona or Florence accompanied by trwo friends. Not a big deal you would have thought, but we can’t find anyone to arrange things. Can anyone who reads this newsgroup point us in the right direction? Any help appreciated.

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Paul and I were at a party last night.  We invited Tom (a friend of mine) and Maura (a friend of Pauls).  The plan was to introduce them (they’d not met until last night).  They hit it off and have planned to go out on a date. However, there was another couple there (I’ll call them Rob & Julie forthe purposes of this post).   Rob walks into the room and sees Maura andis quickly taken aback.  Peacock feathers everywhere!  Maura is a very attractive woman, but he made Julie (his fiance) feel very uncomfortable.  Julie told me later in the night that Rob was having conversations with Maura that he’d never had with her at home.  I asked Rob, if you weren’t dating Julie, would you ask Maura out?  His response:  Certainly.   I hate that.  THat smells like "typical man syndrome" to me.  Why can’t men just be happy with the person they’re with?  I asked Paul when we got home, "if you and I weren’t together, would you be interested in Maura?" ane his response was "there’s a possibility".   but it bothers me that men show off their peacock feathers to everyone else but forget about their partners, and when in public, it’s worse. This annoys me to no end.  I almost felt like reminding Rob (obnoxiously loud) that he had a partner sittingbeside him.  It took everything for me to bite my tongue and keep hushed for the sake of avoiding a scene.  I just felt so bad for Julie. ANyway, anyone understand what I’m saying?

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I asked Rob, if you weren’t dating Julie, would you ask Maura out? His response: Certainly. I hate that. THat smells like "typical man syndrome" to me. Why can’t men just be happy with the person they’re with? I asked Paul when we got home, "if you and I weren’t together, would you be interested in Maura?" ane his response was "there’s a possibility". ANyway, anyone understand what I’m saying?

I understand what you are saying but maybe the question was worded wrong to them.  You asked "if you weren’t dating Julie" or "if you and I were not together" would you ask Maura out.  You didn’t ask would you date her now (while you were with me). They are probably very happy with who they are with now but if they were not with their current partner I’m sure they would date others. Liz C

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Why is this any of your business?  Can’t Julie take care of herself and her relationship? In article – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Paul and I were at a party last night.  We invited Tom (a friend of mine) and Maura (a friend of Pauls).  The plan was to introduce them (they’d not met until last night).  They hit it off and have planned to go out on a date. However, there was another couple there (I’ll call them Rob & Julie forthe purposes of this post).   Rob walks into the room and sees Maura andis quickly taken aback.  Peacock feathers everywhere!  Maura is a very attractive woman, but he made Julie (his fiance) feel very uncomfortable.  Julie told me later in the night that Rob was having conversations with Maura that he’d never had with her at home.  I asked Rob, if you weren’t dating Julie, would you ask Maura out?  His response:  Certainly.   I hate that.  THat smells like "typical man syndrome" to me.  Why can’t men just be happy with the person they’re with?  I asked Paul when we got home, "if you and I weren’t together, would you be interested in Maura?" ane his response was "there’s a possibility".   but it bothers me that men show off their peacock feathers to everyone else but forget about their partners, and when in public, it’s worse. This annoys me to no end.  I almost felt like reminding Rob (obnoxiously loud) that he had a partner sittingbeside him.  It took everything for me to bite my tongue and keep hushed for the sake of avoiding a scene.  I just felt so bad for Julie. ANyway, anyone understand what I’m saying?

– JF Please reply by post. I do not check this email account for messages.    http://www.newsfeeds.com       The Largest Usenet Servers in the World!

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Hi All: I’m getting ready to launch my new website on July 1st. It’s my idea to make it the most interactive site there is for brides and grooms, and to offer the most info. For example, I’ll have a message board (minus the porn, etc.) for brides as well as grooms. We’ll offer a lisitng of all professional organizations that are there to help you–from music to premarital counseling, to interfaith marriage, etc. We’ll feature a directory of bridal gown manufacturers’ to give you all necessary addresses, phone numbers and websites. Since I get about 100 e-mails per day from all of you out there,  I’m trying to base our info services on what you need. Please give me ideas; I’d really appreciate it.   All the best, author, "For the Bride" And the NEWLY RELEASED, "The Elegant Wedding & The Budget-Savvy Bride (How To Have the Wedding of Your Dreams For Half the Price)"

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How about some info for 2nd time marriages?  There seems to be very little info out there, most pages go on about the long white wedding dresses, the big sit-down dinners, and honeymoons in the Bahamas. It’d be nice to find info on smaller, more intimate ceremonies, receptions and honeymoons.  Tips for the older bride, stuff like that       Meenie – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi All: I’m getting ready to launch my new website on July 1st. It’s my idea to make it the most interactive site there is for brides and grooms, and to offer the most info. For example, I’ll have a message board (minus the porn, etc.) for brides as well as grooms. We’ll offer a lisitng of all professional organizations that are there to help you–from music to premarital counseling, to interfaith marriage, etc. We’ll feature a directory of bridal gown manufacturers’ to give you all necessary addresses, phone numbers and websites. Since I get about 100 e-mails per day from all of you out there,  I’m trying to base our info services on what you need. Please give me ideas; I’d really appreciate it. All the best, author, "For the Bride" And the NEWLY RELEASED, "The Elegant Wedding & The Budget-Savvy Bride (How To Have the Wedding of Your Dreams For Half the Price)"

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While in Chapters not too long ago, there was a book (andI can’t rememebr the name, sorry) that was all about "second marriages, difficult families, and dinner parties to suit both".  I breezed through it and realized it to be a very down to earth approach to planning special occasions. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – How about some info for 2nd time marriages?  There seems to be very little info out there, most pages go on about the long white wedding dresses, the big sit-down dinners, and honeymoons in the Bahamas. It’d be nice to find info on smaller, more intimate ceremonies, receptions and honeymoons.  Tips for the older bride, stuff like that       Meenie Hi All: I’m getting ready to launch my new website on July 1st. It’s my idea to make it the most interactive site there is for brides and grooms, and to offer the most info. For example, I’ll have a message board (minus the porn, etc.) for brides as well as grooms. We’ll offer a lisitng of all professional organizations that are there to help you–from music to premarital counseling, to interfaith marriage, etc. We’ll feature a directory of bridal gown manufacturers’ to give you all necessary addresses, phone numbers and websites. Since I get about 100 e-mails per day from all of you out there,  I’m trying to base our info services on what you need. Please give me ideas; I’d really appreciate it. All the best, author, "For the Bride" And the NEWLY RELEASED, "The Elegant Wedding & The Budget-Savvy Bride (How To Have the Wedding of Your Dreams For Half the Price)"

Shelley, to Paul August 7, 1999 – SEE OUR WEDDING WEBSITE – www.chebucto.ns.ca/~ah054/Profile.html

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Hi All: I’m getting ready to launch my new website on July 1st.

Snip Please give me ideas; I’d really appreciate it.  

Start by making sure you use proper grammar and spelling. Errors in spelling and usage, typos, and other mistakes are guaranteed to make a site look less than professional. I’ve seen more than a few sites that could have been very good if only someone had taken the time to proofread first. M. Return e-mail is *never* checked. Please post all responses.

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My fianc